Twin Aster (Man in Space’s conworld megathread)
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Quick update—via sound change, I've discovered the following sentence in Middle Sỉsǒk Tlar Kyanà:
Bsyày bsyảy bsyày bsyȁy bsyày.
bsyày bsyảy bsyày bsyȁy bsyày
3SG.F carve rich partial.hole well
'she carves a wealthy hole in (as opposed to through) the well'
Bsyày bsyảy bsyày bsyȁy bsyày.
bsyày bsyảy bsyày bsyȁy bsyày
3SG.F carve rich partial.hole well
'she carves a wealthy hole in (as opposed to through) the well'
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
I love you, Chaotic Shiny.
So this is the story of the Balloon War. (This is going to be told with a little more levity than usual because it's 5:00 AM here and I haven't gotten to sleep yet.)
One of the several empires that the Tim Ar got passed around was at war with a neighbor. There was one region in particular, situated on the border, that just would not fall to siege or sword. It had supply lines, resources, population, and a chokehold on moving people deeper into enemy territory. This ruffled quite a few feathers at home, because this particular city was vital if they wanted to make their way into the interior.
Enter some genius who was basically the analogue of the Montgolfier brothers. He builds a working hot-air balloon and gets the bright idea that, hey, maybe these things can be used for more than just impressing scientists. We can stake them into the ground and use them for aerial reconnaissance (as was done during the Civil War, incidentally). Then he gets another idea—maybe we can use them to drop troops or bombs on things. The wind currents were favorable at this location for sending balloons across enemy territory and then back into friendly areas (provided they could stay up that long, of course), so it wasn't necessarily a suicide mission.
Not-Montgolfier figures out how to keep the things aloft long enough for them to actually be of use and gives a demonstration. Laden with assorted pieces of garbage as ballast, he lifts into the air drops things on a field while inviting archers to shoot at him. Naturally something goes wrong and a few people die because A) he didn't properly anticipate where the things would actually fall (because air resistance, drag, what have you) and B) some people were idiots and wandered onto the field, but the balloon itself manages to avoid being turned into a pincushion. The brass is impressed enough that instead of summarily executing him they put him in charge of the invasion.
Ersatz Montgolfier was a brilliant scientist. He was a not-so-brilliant tactician. The balloons he designed were larger, less stable, not tested adequately, and in some cases jury-rigged. His weapons were scaled-up versions of typical incendiary devices and large pieces of debris, but at least these worked satisfactorily.
The day the invasion is scheduled to take place, there is poor visibility and high winds. The launch goes ahead anyway, with a hundred and fifty balloons. Of those, two ignite on the ground before properly inflating. One's canopy rips away just prior to takeoff and blunders into another, which catches on fire in the staging area. One collides with a building before gaining sufficient altitude to clear it and ends up wrapped around a bell tower; the balloon then catches the bell tower on fire, and the fire quickly spreads to envelop the local residential district. One is destroyed in the air when one of the onboard incendiary devices ignites; the balloon drifts into another, which somehow avoids burning up, and another, which isn't so lucky. One smacks into a mountain (it did not set the mountain on fire). Twenty-five manage to avoid bursting into flames long enough to discover that they have leaks and slowly lose altitude while in friendly territory; the canopy of another violently loses integrity several miles short of its target, sending it hurtling downward into a forest and sparking a massive wildfire. One crew pilots the balloon too high, passes out, and doesn't come to until they've missed all the action and wound up much farther away than planned. An additional twelve catch fire in the air en route to the city they're supposed to attack and lose their ability to do anything except plummet to the ground and kill the occupants. Seven more are destroyed when they drift under the trajectory of some of the rubble that was dropped. A final balloon suffers the misfortune of having the wires connecting the gondola to the envelope catching fire; the envelope continues on, blazing, while the gondola discovers why lithobraking is not a good idea if you're not a Kerbal.
For all the failure that occurs on behalf of the instigators, the people of the region below are taken unaware and completely demoralized. The air is foggy, but the day is otherwise normal until things start falling from the sky (blowing up in some cases) and destroying things. On top of that, there are a couple of huge, floating, flaming monstrosities that slowly drift downward, covering a large area with a blanket of fire before destroying themselves and everything they touch. Not to mention the huge forest fire that suddenly erupted relatively close to the city…
TL;DR: Despite everything going wrong, mission still somehow accomplished.
So this is the story of the Balloon War. (This is going to be told with a little more levity than usual because it's 5:00 AM here and I haven't gotten to sleep yet.)
One of the several empires that the Tim Ar got passed around was at war with a neighbor. There was one region in particular, situated on the border, that just would not fall to siege or sword. It had supply lines, resources, population, and a chokehold on moving people deeper into enemy territory. This ruffled quite a few feathers at home, because this particular city was vital if they wanted to make their way into the interior.
Enter some genius who was basically the analogue of the Montgolfier brothers. He builds a working hot-air balloon and gets the bright idea that, hey, maybe these things can be used for more than just impressing scientists. We can stake them into the ground and use them for aerial reconnaissance (as was done during the Civil War, incidentally). Then he gets another idea—maybe we can use them to drop troops or bombs on things. The wind currents were favorable at this location for sending balloons across enemy territory and then back into friendly areas (provided they could stay up that long, of course), so it wasn't necessarily a suicide mission.
Not-Montgolfier figures out how to keep the things aloft long enough for them to actually be of use and gives a demonstration. Laden with assorted pieces of garbage as ballast, he lifts into the air drops things on a field while inviting archers to shoot at him. Naturally something goes wrong and a few people die because A) he didn't properly anticipate where the things would actually fall (because air resistance, drag, what have you) and B) some people were idiots and wandered onto the field, but the balloon itself manages to avoid being turned into a pincushion. The brass is impressed enough that instead of summarily executing him they put him in charge of the invasion.
Ersatz Montgolfier was a brilliant scientist. He was a not-so-brilliant tactician. The balloons he designed were larger, less stable, not tested adequately, and in some cases jury-rigged. His weapons were scaled-up versions of typical incendiary devices and large pieces of debris, but at least these worked satisfactorily.
The day the invasion is scheduled to take place, there is poor visibility and high winds. The launch goes ahead anyway, with a hundred and fifty balloons. Of those, two ignite on the ground before properly inflating. One's canopy rips away just prior to takeoff and blunders into another, which catches on fire in the staging area. One collides with a building before gaining sufficient altitude to clear it and ends up wrapped around a bell tower; the balloon then catches the bell tower on fire, and the fire quickly spreads to envelop the local residential district. One is destroyed in the air when one of the onboard incendiary devices ignites; the balloon drifts into another, which somehow avoids burning up, and another, which isn't so lucky. One smacks into a mountain (it did not set the mountain on fire). Twenty-five manage to avoid bursting into flames long enough to discover that they have leaks and slowly lose altitude while in friendly territory; the canopy of another violently loses integrity several miles short of its target, sending it hurtling downward into a forest and sparking a massive wildfire. One crew pilots the balloon too high, passes out, and doesn't come to until they've missed all the action and wound up much farther away than planned. An additional twelve catch fire in the air en route to the city they're supposed to attack and lose their ability to do anything except plummet to the ground and kill the occupants. Seven more are destroyed when they drift under the trajectory of some of the rubble that was dropped. A final balloon suffers the misfortune of having the wires connecting the gondola to the envelope catching fire; the envelope continues on, blazing, while the gondola discovers why lithobraking is not a good idea if you're not a Kerbal.
For all the failure that occurs on behalf of the instigators, the people of the region below are taken unaware and completely demoralized. The air is foggy, but the day is otherwise normal until things start falling from the sky (blowing up in some cases) and destroying things. On top of that, there are a couple of huge, floating, flaming monstrosities that slowly drift downward, covering a large area with a blanket of fire before destroying themselves and everything they touch. Not to mention the huge forest fire that suddenly erupted relatively close to the city…
TL;DR: Despite everything going wrong, mission still somehow accomplished.
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
NLEBH;RIA: I was beginning to wonder if ány of the balloons were going to make it! There's some good background here for the story of a valiant crew who's able to jury rig their balloon before falling prey to one of the ten thousand things that seem to plague this particular design and are then able to go on to carry out their mission.Linguifex wrote:So this is the story of the Balloon War. (...)
For all the failure that occurs on behalf of the instigators, the people of the region below are taken unaware and completely demoralized. The air is foggy, but the day is otherwise normal until things start falling from the sky (blowing up in some cases) and destroying things. On top of that, there are a couple of huge, floating, flaming monstrosities that slowly drift downward, covering a large area with a blanket of fire before destroying themselves and everything they touch. Not to mention the huge forest fire that suddenly erupted relatively close to the city…
TL;DR: Despite everything going wrong, mission still somehow accomplished.
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
"Not long enough by half; read it all"?elemtilas wrote:NLEBH;RIA:
Thank you! I'm actually planning on having the event spawn off a few idioms and cultural metaphors for the Tim Ar.elemtilas wrote:I was beginning to wonder if ány of the balloons were going to make it! There's some good background here for the story of a valiant crew who's able to jury rig their balloon before falling prey to one of the ten thousand things that seem to plague this particular design and are then able to go on to carry out their mission.
I've decided this planet will have two moons with a 243:395 resonance in their orbital periods (same as Earth and Venus). Once certain groups figure out astronomy, the "restart" of the cycle will become a major holiday for those religions. Now I just have to figure out the calendar. One of the moons is pretty close in parameters to ours; the other is quite a bit further out and smaller (and has a higher albedo, to boot). I figure the tides will be somewhat more severe (and the cycles more of a headache) on this planet as a consequence.
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Linguifex wrote:"Not long enough by half; read it all"?elemtilas wrote:NLEBH;RIA:
Spiff! Definitely looking forward to reading more about this.Linguifex wrote:Thank you! I'm actually planning on having the event spawn off a few idioms and cultural metaphors for the Tim Ar.elemtilas wrote:I was beginning to wonder if ány of the balloons were going to make it! There's some good background here for the story of a valiant crew who's able to jury rig their balloon before falling prey to one of the ten thousand things that seem to plague this particular design and are then able to go on to carry out their mission.
And anyway, airships are just so all that and a kettle of crisps. Any ideas what these early airships look like? Have you sketched any pictures?
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- roman
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- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
I have some idioms in mind—you don't go launching balloons in a windstorm 'don't go off half-cocked', a balloon offensive 'a situation that goes wrong but somehow still succeeds', floating in the air and sitting on a fire 'this isn't going to end well', attacking [city name] with balloons 'a stupid idea (especially one with popular support)', and piloting your balloon too high 'trying to work harder than or outperform everyone, leading to negative results'.elemtilas wrote:Spiff! Definitely looking forward to reading more about this.
(Unrelated to that incident, there's also tëk mûr 'kick a tree', meaning 'make no progress'. You get things like ha3ál tëk n úmir 'tree-kicker', 'someone who can't/doesn't make any progress despite taking action' > 'obstinate person', 'powerless person', 'ineffectual person', 'bureaucrat (pejorative)'.)
I have some vague ideas. No sketches though.elemtilas wrote:And anyway, airships are just so all that and a kettle of crisps. Any ideas what these early airships look like? Have you sketched any pictures?
OK, so calendars. I could use a lot of help on this, especially checking my math.
A few relevant pieces of information:
- Local (solar) day is 22.10 hours.
- Planet orbits primary every 398.27 local days.
- Primary moon orbits planet every 29.81 local days.
- Secondary moon orbits planet every 46.88 local days.
Classical Khaya – 13 months, thirty-day months with every fifth month having twenty-nine days. Ten extra days a year leads to a leap month every three years. After five years, short months create thirteen extra days (close enough to fourteen, or two weeks), leading to a leap month every ten years. Each thirtieth year therefore has two extra months. At some point during the history of the calendar, leap years become an issue, so every forty-eight years, each of the thirteen "prime" months is given an extra day.
Spoiler:
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I'm not sure which system I want the Tim Ar to eventually use. The Tim Ar are descended from the same culture as the O, but the Tim Ar's forebears in particular were conquered by many groups, the Khaya being the first such invaders. I could also see them adopting the Täptäg system due to trade (or conversely the Täptäg abandoning theirs in favor of whatever system it is the Tim Ar are using). Less plausible, but still an option, is the Caber system being imported. Thoughts?
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Another notes dump.
Spoiler:
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
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- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
The various languages of the Tlusa family are designated P-, T-, C-, K-, V-, F-, or N-Tlusa. The first four are named after the consonant that lenited to the glottal stop; V-Tlusa is so named because of its vowel effects; F-Tlusa, because all singleton stops lenited to their corresponding fricatives between vowels; and N-Tlusa, for its nasal processes.
What follows is a comparison of the protolanguage and the subfamily progenitors. These are the numbers one to six, followed by thirty-six and two hundred sixteen.
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Ghaazhgeen dump:
Spoiler:
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Has it really been over a year since I've posted in this thread? Man…
I've been through the wringer but, hopefully, I can continue.
So I was messing around with gleb the other day and I hit upon something interesting. After modifying it, I have the following phonology.
/m n/
/p b t d tʲ dʲ k g/
/ɾ j w/
/ʎ ʟ/
/i e a ɨ o u/
/ь ъ m̩ n̩/ (I guess the nasals here are considered yers)
(K)(X)(C)(R)V(U) syllable structure, where:
K = One of /k g j w ʎ ʟ ь ъ/
X = One of /p t tʲ k n ɾ m w ь ъ/
C = Any consonant, or /ь ъ/
R = One of /ɾ j w ʎ ʟ/
U = One of /p b t d tʲ dʲ k g ɾ j w ʎ ʟ/
The yers tend to signify that something has screwed up, especially when /r/ gets involved as it is low on this language's sonority hierarchy—more plosive-like than resonant-like. In the typical case the yers crop up due to a violation of the sonority hierarchy, but are technically phonemic because there's only really four of them, and even then most of the time [m̩] assimilates to [n̩]. Palatal phones become /ь/, while velars become /ъ/, and the nasals just syllabify and assimilate to a following labial or coronal.
The yers do various things in various languages. In some they are reflected as spirantization or voicing. In others, you end up with palatalization or labialization/velarization, as appropriate. In still others they simply drop, while they are "promoted" to full vowels in others still. Add vowel dissimilation or centering into the mix in some languages and you have a recipe fordisaster awesomeness.
I've been through the wringer but, hopefully, I can continue.
So I was messing around with gleb the other day and I hit upon something interesting. After modifying it, I have the following phonology.
/m n/
/p b t d tʲ dʲ k g/
/ɾ j w/
/ʎ ʟ/
/i e a ɨ o u/
/ь ъ m̩ n̩/ (I guess the nasals here are considered yers)
(K)(X)(C)(R)V(U) syllable structure, where:
K = One of /k g j w ʎ ʟ ь ъ/
X = One of /p t tʲ k n ɾ m w ь ъ/
C = Any consonant, or /ь ъ/
R = One of /ɾ j w ʎ ʟ/
U = One of /p b t d tʲ dʲ k g ɾ j w ʎ ʟ/
- Before /ʎ j i ь/, /t d/ become [tʲ dʲ].
- Most initial geminate sequences simply degeminate. With coronals, it's a bit more complex. There's some progressive voicing assimilation for coronal stops that happens, and then the sequences /ttʲ ddʲ tʲt dʲd/ become [stʲ zdʲ ʃt ʒd].
The yers tend to signify that something has screwed up, especially when /r/ gets involved as it is low on this language's sonority hierarchy—more plosive-like than resonant-like. In the typical case the yers crop up due to a violation of the sonority hierarchy, but are technically phonemic because there's only really four of them, and even then most of the time [m̩] assimilates to [n̩]. Palatal phones become /ь/, while velars become /ъ/, and the nasals just syllabify and assimilate to a following labial or coronal.
The yers do various things in various languages. In some they are reflected as spirantization or voicing. In others, you end up with palatalization or labialization/velarization, as appropriate. In still others they simply drop, while they are "promoted" to full vowels in others still. Add vowel dissimilation or centering into the mix in some languages and you have a recipe for
- yu
- tʲwɨ
- ьtidʲ
- krɨy
- tyedʲ
- ьdʲɨt
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Good to see you're still at it! I also hope you'll continue, fruitfully multiplying all the goodness of your worlds for us to read here!
- gestaltist
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Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
I'm confused about initial yers. AFAIK, Slavic yers were always postconsonantal. Could you explain a bit more about how your yers work?
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- roman
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- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
OK, so basically, the yers in this language started out as allophones of resonants or glides that got stuck on the wrong side of an obstruent (*r was more obstruent-like than resonant-like in the synchronic presentation of the protolanguage, so if you had, say, *yr- then *y syllabified). Basically the palatal liquids became *ь, the velar liquids became *ъ, and the nasals simply turned into their own little syllable nucleus. (That reminds me, I have to add *y into the *X consonant class.)gestaltist wrote: ↑03 Aug 2018 14:16 I'm confused about initial yers. AFAIK, Slavic yers were always postconsonantal. Could you explain a bit more about how your yers work?
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Notes on the Tim Ar-O cultural complex
The Proto-Tim Ar-O culture (PTO) is believed to have been associated with the Notched Stick culture (NSC). The NSC is noted for its decorated sticks—not necessarily notched; there are also scored, drilled, painted, and otherwise-decorated artifacts, not all of which are sticks—that appear to have served a purpose similar to quipu. The NSC appears to have resided a moderate distance north of the Burning Mountains in the western portion of the supercontinent. In this area, temperate forest and grassland meet the only sizable steppes on the entire planet, which constitutes a region approximately the size of the United States.
What is notable about the PTO is that, much like the Inca, they appear to have lacked a writing system entirely; the eponymous notched sticks appear to have related information such as tax calculations and census data in a manner, as stated above, akin to quipu. Our first written evidence of the culture that would split off into the Tim Ar and the O (among others) comes from the Classical Khaya, who called them Fiha 'people of ten' after their unusual base-ten counting system (the Classical Khaya used a base-twelve system). After some time exacting tribute from various fringe areas of the NSC, the NSC appears to have fallen victim to a combination of famine and conquest by the Classical Khaya, some being absorbed and others scattering.
One constant throughout the various descendant groups is a strong emphasis on bloodlines in some way. The Tim Ar either developed this into a or retained an original system of extended kinship that involves skin groups, of which there are twenty—sixteen "full" and four "immigrant"—which govern an individual's marriageability and legal descent. The O feature a more general areal and familial system. Regardless, the emphasis on blood ties is strong in most daughter cultures, which generally consider the family one's highest priority.
The Proto-Tim Ar-O culture (PTO) is believed to have been associated with the Notched Stick culture (NSC). The NSC is noted for its decorated sticks—not necessarily notched; there are also scored, drilled, painted, and otherwise-decorated artifacts, not all of which are sticks—that appear to have served a purpose similar to quipu. The NSC appears to have resided a moderate distance north of the Burning Mountains in the western portion of the supercontinent. In this area, temperate forest and grassland meet the only sizable steppes on the entire planet, which constitutes a region approximately the size of the United States.
What is notable about the PTO is that, much like the Inca, they appear to have lacked a writing system entirely; the eponymous notched sticks appear to have related information such as tax calculations and census data in a manner, as stated above, akin to quipu. Our first written evidence of the culture that would split off into the Tim Ar and the O (among others) comes from the Classical Khaya, who called them Fiha 'people of ten' after their unusual base-ten counting system (the Classical Khaya used a base-twelve system). After some time exacting tribute from various fringe areas of the NSC, the NSC appears to have fallen victim to a combination of famine and conquest by the Classical Khaya, some being absorbed and others scattering.
One constant throughout the various descendant groups is a strong emphasis on bloodlines in some way. The Tim Ar either developed this into a or retained an original system of extended kinship that involves skin groups, of which there are twenty—sixteen "full" and four "immigrant"—which govern an individual's marriageability and legal descent. The O feature a more general areal and familial system. Regardless, the emphasis on blood ties is strong in most daughter cultures, which generally consider the family one's highest priority.
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Wow, it's been a while. New board, too.
I'm still working on Twin Aster; it has a dedicated wiki now that is in a perpetual state of incompletion.
Yesterday (read: a few hours ago), I officially named the Tlar Kyanà ministry of intelligence: The Ê ê Ê Ê. Yes, that is the full name. Yes, they were all different etyma that collapsed to the same phonetic realization (had it existed in the protolanguage, it would have been originally *ʔjɛɾ B ɛʔ B ʔwɛ B ɛɾ B, all four words of which collapsed to → /e B2/).
Caber still exists, I've just been very quiet on it lately.
I'm trying to figure out what to do with the Tim Ar. I know some Iroquoian groups pass inheritance to the nieces/nephews with the aim of keeping it with the male's family, but Tim Ar culture is very rigidly patriarchal and I'm not sure how that would go over. It would be interesting, and I kind of really want to do it, but I'm not sure how to justify it with their "la famiglia is everything" mentality.
I'm also trying to figure out what to do with their language, on several fronts.
- I had cuneiform for them, but I lost the notebooks. Several times. I'm considering just going back to hieroglyphics. But I really want to do cuneiform, but have little motivation within me to start from scratch again. I might have some pictures somewhere, but I'd have to trawl through my phone to find them if so.
- I'm not sure their language has changed enough for the Classical stage. I could probably get away with the changes I have now if I made them go very far afield, which to be honest isn't really a bad idea, but I'm kind of attached to the conceits I do have.
I have a spreadsheet where I'm starting to tackle the "big history" by continent.
I got the urge yesterday to make a protolanguage with the reported inventory of Wichita, but I'm kind of at a loss as to how to proceed from there.
So yeah, if anybody's got any feedback or ideas, I'm happy to hear them.
I'm still working on Twin Aster; it has a dedicated wiki now that is in a perpetual state of incompletion.
Yesterday (read: a few hours ago), I officially named the Tlar Kyanà ministry of intelligence: The Ê ê Ê Ê. Yes, that is the full name. Yes, they were all different etyma that collapsed to the same phonetic realization (had it existed in the protolanguage, it would have been originally *ʔjɛɾ B ɛʔ B ʔwɛ B ɛɾ B, all four words of which collapsed to → /e B2/).
Caber still exists, I've just been very quiet on it lately.
I'm trying to figure out what to do with the Tim Ar. I know some Iroquoian groups pass inheritance to the nieces/nephews with the aim of keeping it with the male's family, but Tim Ar culture is very rigidly patriarchal and I'm not sure how that would go over. It would be interesting, and I kind of really want to do it, but I'm not sure how to justify it with their "la famiglia is everything" mentality.
I'm also trying to figure out what to do with their language, on several fronts.
- I had cuneiform for them, but I lost the notebooks. Several times. I'm considering just going back to hieroglyphics. But I really want to do cuneiform, but have little motivation within me to start from scratch again. I might have some pictures somewhere, but I'd have to trawl through my phone to find them if so.
- I'm not sure their language has changed enough for the Classical stage. I could probably get away with the changes I have now if I made them go very far afield, which to be honest isn't really a bad idea, but I'm kind of attached to the conceits I do have.
I have a spreadsheet where I'm starting to tackle the "big history" by continent.
I got the urge yesterday to make a protolanguage with the reported inventory of Wichita, but I'm kind of at a loss as to how to proceed from there.
So yeah, if anybody's got any feedback or ideas, I'm happy to hear them.
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Nothing specific, other than that it's good to see you back!
Will be interesting to see what you come up with historywise!
Will be interesting to see what you come up with historywise!
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Agreed! It's definitely been a while, but glad to see an update [:)]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
- Man in Space
- roman
- Posts: 1309
- Joined: 03 Aug 2012 08:07
- Location: Ohio
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Administrative Divisions of the Kmtön n Tim Ar (subject to change)
mkîȝ (pl. mkîȝ ar) – roughly 'region'. There are eleven: Éí, Entáhtórula, Ïĝuntá, Krníĝ, Lákðor, Mrkás, Seksín, Sínsio, Tikát, Uêlmi, and ʕëkoð.
ȝôtáʕ (pl. uȝétáʕ) – roughly 'province', 'state', or 'oblast'. There are quite a number of these.
haʕm (pl. aham) – roughly 'county' or 'raion'. Sub-level of a ȝôtáʕ.
łiłtúke (pl. iłtúke—might change that to ihtúke or ihłtúke, as CT dislikes geminates) – roughly 'metro area' or 'selsoviet', more or less a focal city and its suburbs; provinces often have more than one.
kámr (pl. ákmr) – 'city', more or less.
lûk (pl. íluk) – roughly 'borough'. Sub-part of a large city.
There are a few special cases:
kámr ȝér (pl. ákmr ȝér) – 'free city'. There's a few of these, typically city-states that have special status due to joining by treaty or otherwise willingly handing over sovereignty to the Empire. Not quite a province, but carries more weight than a city.
łektóron (pl. ełktóron) – roughly 'suzerainty'. There's a handful of these, and they can be made up of one ȝôtáʕ or multiple uȝétáʕ. These are typically not part of any mkîȝ but are reckoned to themselves; they tend to be smaller than an mkîȝ, though.
lérnar îktu ro (pl. élrnar îktu ro) - 'unorganized territory'. There's two main ones, namely the Lé Mêĝ (the area of the eponymous valley) and the Ȝátákorekô out to the south central area, which is still bombed to all hell and hasn't recovered.
mkîȝ haĝkë n ákðu tísík – 'special administrative zone'. There's one of these, namely the Msítiun.
húkór (pl. úhkór) – '(frontier) territory'. Typically these are recently-captured lands that haven't undergone the full process of admission/assimilation into the Empire yet, for whatever reason.
mkîȝ (pl. mkîȝ ar) – roughly 'region'. There are eleven: Éí, Entáhtórula, Ïĝuntá, Krníĝ, Lákðor, Mrkás, Seksín, Sínsio, Tikát, Uêlmi, and ʕëkoð.
ȝôtáʕ (pl. uȝétáʕ) – roughly 'province', 'state', or 'oblast'. There are quite a number of these.
haʕm (pl. aham) – roughly 'county' or 'raion'. Sub-level of a ȝôtáʕ.
łiłtúke (pl. iłtúke—might change that to ihtúke or ihłtúke, as CT dislikes geminates) – roughly 'metro area' or 'selsoviet', more or less a focal city and its suburbs; provinces often have more than one.
kámr (pl. ákmr) – 'city', more or less.
lûk (pl. íluk) – roughly 'borough'. Sub-part of a large city.
There are a few special cases:
kámr ȝér (pl. ákmr ȝér) – 'free city'. There's a few of these, typically city-states that have special status due to joining by treaty or otherwise willingly handing over sovereignty to the Empire. Not quite a province, but carries more weight than a city.
łektóron (pl. ełktóron) – roughly 'suzerainty'. There's a handful of these, and they can be made up of one ȝôtáʕ or multiple uȝétáʕ. These are typically not part of any mkîȝ but are reckoned to themselves; they tend to be smaller than an mkîȝ, though.
lérnar îktu ro (pl. élrnar îktu ro) - 'unorganized territory'. There's two main ones, namely the Lé Mêĝ (the area of the eponymous valley) and the Ȝátákorekô out to the south central area, which is still bombed to all hell and hasn't recovered.
mkîȝ haĝkë n ákðu tísík – 'special administrative zone'. There's one of these, namely the Msítiun.
húkór (pl. úhkór) – '(frontier) territory'. Typically these are recently-captured lands that haven't undergone the full process of admission/assimilation into the Empire yet, for whatever reason.
Twin Aster megathread
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
AVDIO · VIDEO · DISCO
CC = Common Caber
CK = Classical Khaya
CT = Classical Ĝare n Tim Ar
Kg = Kgáweq'
PB = Proto-Beheic
PO = Proto-O
PTa = Proto-Taltic
STK = Sisỏk Tlar Kyanà
Tm = Təmattwəspwaypksma
- eldin raigmore
- korean
- Posts: 6354
- Joined: 14 Aug 2010 19:38
- Location: SouthEast Michigan
Re: Linguifex's conworld megathread
Is it possible that “cent” and “canton” are related in your concountry?
Is a “canton” (in the Swiss sense) like a “hundred” (in the Medieval English sense, a unit of local government)?
Just because Kmtom kinda sounds like both.
Is a “canton” (in the Swiss sense) like a “hundred” (in the Medieval English sense, a unit of local government)?
Just because Kmtom kinda sounds like both.
My minicity is http://gonabebig1day.myminicity.com/xml