(EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 27 Aug 2018, 03:21

Dormouse559 wrote:
Mon 20 Aug 2018, 04:02
Khemehekis wrote:
Mon 20 Aug 2018, 03:11
Well, I was thinking of this line: "Obtaining alcohol for consumption is no exception, and the millennial beverage of choice is wine."
The article writer says that, but that just tells me they haven't read their own evidence; it's irrelevant to their assertion. And well, they're an undergrad writing in a section of a website with no editorial oversight. The little librarian on my shoulder says they don't qualify as a reliable source.
Wikipedia certainly wouldn't call it a reliable source!

Some googling found this MyRecipes article . . . not sure if it's reliable.

https://www.myrecipes.com/extracrispy/m ... -than-beer
"Millennials Drink More Wine Than Beer, But Like Weed the Most"

It cites this article -- https://www.winespectator.com/webfeature/show/id/52689 -- although I disagree with the 1994 endpoint they use.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 27 Aug 2018, 03:27

Axiem wrote:
Mon 20 Aug 2018, 19:46
Personally, the way I define Millennial is: 1) remembers 9/11, and 2) does not remember the Challenger explosion. That generally means around 82—96, depending on the individual. It's fuzzy at the edges, though.

The idea of a Millennial being in preschool (i.e. 3 or 4 years old) in 2008 is weird to me. I definitely consider them in Generation Z, whatever that ends up being called. And 1979 to me is at the tail end of Generation X.
Let's see . . . I remember 9/11 (obviously), and I don't remember Challenger. I first heard of it when I read a Weekly Reader article that referenced Challenger and said "Seven American astronauts died".
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 27 Aug 2018, 03:40

Axiem wrote:
Tue 21 Aug 2018, 14:57
Salmoneus wrote:
Tue 21 Aug 2018, 12:14
Blackadder, Drop the Dead Donkey, Yes Minister and Red Dwarf repeats, Deayton-era HIGNFY
The only one of those I'm even remotely familiar with is Red Dwarf, and I think I've maybe seen one episode once?
My 1988-born brother likes Red Dwarf.

I've heard of Blackadder because this 1984-born fellow on the 4thkingdom site digs it. He's from Yorkshire, and often references the verbal tics of Blackadder (such as saying a politician is "wibbling"). The Brits on that site have to explain these Blackadderisms to us Americans.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 27 Aug 2018, 05:05

I perceive Millennials as being divided into three waves.

Early Millennials (Seattle wave): 1979-1987. We are the most X-like of the three waves, with much cynicism among us, and even many of the 1987 cohorts perceive themselves as being Xers.

American Seattle-wavers were the people who didn't get behind Bush after 9/11 the way most older Americans did, and accused him, in 2001-2003, of being greedy for oil. A Harris poll of American 13-to-18-year-olds (born 1982-1988) taken mere days after September 11, 2001 found that only 22% of them would be willing to pay higher taxes, only 14% have their phone calls spied on by the goernment, only 3% not be able to practice their religion, and a mere 3% not being able to express their feelings about the government (i.e. Bush-bashing) if it would prevent another 9/11 from happening, in a time when Fox News reported "Americans prefer security to liberty, 2-to-1". Only 38% of teen-age respondents said they would still support the war in Afghanistan if American soldiers, sailors and airmen were killed, and only 31% (19% of girls) said they would still support the war even if innocent civilians were killed. We were the college students among whom military enlistments didn't budge after 9/11, and actually went down as soon as the invasion of Iraq got underway. Even those who supported the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq often saw Junior himself as stupid and unworthy given his positions on domestic issues. We had bad experiences with authority figures in junior high and high school prior to 9/11, which shaped our reaction to the attack at that point in our lives (ages 13-22). We were the pierced teens who inspired Calidornia to pass a bill requiring under18s get permission from our Boomer parents for body piercing in 1997. If you were born between 1980 and 1984, you were likely in high school during Columbine, and remember the civil liberties violations (requiring clear backpacks, a faculty backlash against goths, etc.) that ensued after that school shooting. We were the wave participating in the Battle of Seattle -- along with some late Xers -- in 1999. We remember the flap surrounding Napster in colleges, whether or not we were in college at the time. Even the oldest of us were too young to vote for or against Bill Clinton in 1996. In 2000, some 18-to021-year-olds voted for Junior Bush, Gore, or Nader, though most did not. In 2004, 18-to-25-year-old voters preferred Kerry to Bush. We preferred Obama to the late John McCain in huge numbers in 2008, when 18-to-29-year-olds were Millennials. And of course, we preferred Bernie Sanders over either Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump.

At age 17, our wave listened to music like the Wallflowers, Alanis Morissette, No Doubt, Better than Ezra, Live, Smash Mouth, Sarah McLachlan, Jewel, Third Eye Blind, Sugar Ray, Ricky Martin, Semisonic, OMC, Blink-182, the Barenaked Ladies, Fleming and John, Eminem, Jimmy Eat World, Good Charlotte, Avril Lavigne, Michelle Branch, Pink, Limp Bizkit, Linkin Park, Puddle of Mudd, Nickelback, Evanescence, Nelly, Nelly Furtado, Coldplay, Destiny's Child/Beyonce, and Aaliyah.

Technologically, most of us are old enough to remember rotary phones, and all of us remember a world before cellphones and before social media. My 1981-born sister and I, in fact, grew up learning to literally dial a phone in our house, and remember the day our mother got her first car phone. We played Oregon Trail on the school computer -- we were indeed natives to the PC. We also played the Carmen Sandiego games and other educational computer games, back when there was a strict divide between computer games and video games.

Core Millennials (Occupy wave): 1988-1996. These are the purest Millennials, the typical objects of the media's "avocado toast" jabs and satire. The most Millennial Millennials.

Occupy-wavers were ages 4-13 on 9/11. For the most part, they rallied around Bush and got in sync with the patriotic, jingoistic mood of pre-Millennial Americans at the time. Around 2003, more started to question the system as Iraq was invaded. Their rebellion began in the tenties instead of the nineties, as they passed through their teens and put up dark LiveJournal and DeviantArt pages with My Chemical Romance quotes. In 2011, this wave was dominating the Occupy Wall Street protests. (A thread I saw on the Fourth Turning board around this time referenced core Millennials' appearances in movies as being the whiners, and argued that this wave was being perceived as whiny when it protested Big Banks.) They are also the geekiest wave of Millennials -- they were the target audience for Pokémon, Harry Potter, and Animorphs . . . but also Barney. They were largely raised by Joneser parents, with some Boomer and Gen-X parents in the mix. The first U.S. elections a member of this wave really understood would be the 2000 or 2004 election, and their 18-to-20-year-old members probably preferred Obama over McCain. Much like the early wavers, they would have preferred Bernie to either Hillary or the Trumpster.

At age 17, their wave listened to music like My Chemical Romance, Peter Bjorn & John, KT Tunstall, Taylor Swift, Colbie Caillat, T.I., Lil Wayne, Drake, Soulja Boy, Panic! at the Disco, Death Cab, Fall Out Boy, the Killers, Ingrid Michaelson, Avicii, Bruno Mars, Lady Gaga, Katy Perry, One Direction, Foster the People, OneRepublic, Ke$ha, Gotye, Ellie Goulding, Paolo Nutini, Bassnectar, Carly Rae Jepsen, Muse, Imagine Dragons, Passenger, Adele, Adam Lambert, and Ed Sheeran.

Technologically, they are digital natives, and were starting college, in high school, in junior high, or even in elementary school when Facebook became mainstream (i.e. expanded beyond colleges), so they're social media natives too. They remember a time before smartphones, and the older among them can remember a time before cellphones became mainstream.

Late Millennials (Parkland wave): 1997-2004. These are the most Fifth-Worlder-like Millennials. (I call the generation born 2005-today "Fifth Worlders" because most members of the post-Millennial generation will have their first memories of the world in the Fifth World, as of the Mayan calendar.) Often some or all of them are categorized as "iGen" or "Generation Z" by generational pundits, but Howe & Strauss place them in the Millennial Generation because they remember life before the Crash of 2008.

Parkland-wavers were, for the most part, too young to understand what was going on on September 11, 2001, even if they remember it -- and many weren't born at all (they were all under 5 at the time). Their rebellion didn't begin until this decade, as they passed through adolescence and felt stifled by their Gen-X parents. They acquired their name and fame as a political lot after a school shooting occurred at Douglas High in Parkland, Florida earlier this year and teen-age Parkland-wavers impressed older people through their activism both for and against gun control. If Washington, D.C. votes to lower its voting age to 16 this autumn, Parkland-wave Washingtonians will become this year the first post-Civil-War wave of Americans to attain suffrage before their eighteenth birthday. They are also the most depressed wave of Millennials, compared to the other two waves at like age (teens, early twenties). 1997-to-2000 cohorts often turned out to campaign for Bernie in Election 2016, and their 18-and-19-year-olds overwhelmingly voted for him in the primaries. In the 2020 Election, 1997-2002 or 1997-2004 cohorts will be eligible to vote. The oldest will be 23.

At age 17, their wave has listened to music like Bastille, Clean Bandit, Sia, Kendrick Lamar, Cardi B, Amy Shark, Shawn Mendes, Hailee Steinfeld, Alessia Cara, Ariana Grande, Iggy Azalea, the Revivalists, Portugal. The Man, John Legend, Twenty One Pilots, Zedd, Dua Lipa, Lil Yachty, Childish Gambino, Echosmith, Pharrell, Meghan Trainor, and the list will contin7e.

Technologically, they are the most digitally native out of all three waves, unable to remember a time without a cellphone (or two or three) on every corner. They are also unlikely to remember a music world before the iPod, and are natives to the use of iPhones or perhaps Androids. They have always had iTunes around, and are unlikely to remember firsthand the Napster flap.
Last edited by Khemehekis on Wed 29 Aug 2018, 22:46, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by KaiTheHomoSapien » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 04:16

Wow, you certainly have given this a lot of thought [O.O]

Having been born in 2000, I still consider myself "Gen Z" over "Millennial" (a perception of being born in 1999+ is perhaps regarding "Millennials" as being in their 20s and 30s now and thus not qualifying as one at 18), but the group you describe (whatever the name) seems valid.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by elemtilas » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 04:30

KaiTheHomoSapien wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 04:16
Wow, you certainly have given this a lot of thought [O.O]

Having been born in 2000, I still consider myself "Gen Z" over "Millennial" (a perception of being born in 1999+ is perhaps regarding "Millennials" as being in their 20s and 30s now and thus not qualifying as one at 18), but the group you describe (whatever the name) seems valid.
He could probably write a book, with all that kind of data!

I don't consider myself any generation anything. When it comes that era's music or politics or books or television programmes or whatever, my usual thought to myself is "I have no idea what they're talking about!" It's like they all come from a different planet or something.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by gestaltist » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 09:19

I don't know why people find these generational categorizations so important. I always felt they were overgeneralizations.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by elemtilas » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 11:34

gestaltist wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 09:19
I don't know why people find these generational categorizations so important. I always felt they were overgeneralizations.
Ah, a fellow non-generational!

Obviously I don't find them important, and they're certainly matters of self or group identification, but I do find the whole concept of generationing to be confusingly interesting to observe.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Salmoneus » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 14:16

Wow. People so hip they don't even acknowledge the existence of time...
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by elemtilas » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 15:31

Salmoneus wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 14:16
Wow. People so hip they don't even acknowledge the existence of time...
You got that right mister!
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by shimobaatar » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 16:22

Not liking or agreeing with the way generations are defined is the same as not acknowledging the existence of time?
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by gestaltist » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 19:01

Salmoneus wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 14:16
Wow. People so hip they don't even acknowledge the existence of time...
Really, Salmoneus? A straw-man argument coming from you? I'm disappointed.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Salmoneus » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 21:51

shimobaatar wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 16:22
Not liking or agreeing with the way generations are defined is the same as not acknowledging the existence of time?
Disagreeing with the details of the way generations are defined is one thing - this thread is full of it. But claiming not to belong to a generation, or denying the existence of generations, is nonsensical.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by gestaltist » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 22:17

Salmoneus wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 21:51
shimobaatar wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 16:22
Not liking or agreeing with the way generations are defined is the same as not acknowledging the existence of time?
Disagreeing with the details of the way generations are defined is one thing - this thread is full of it. But claiming not to belong to a generation, or denying the existence of generations, is nonsensical.
Is it really, though? Generations, as they are defined/used in this thread are artificial constructs, shoehorning people to one category or another. Nobody in their right mind would deny that living in a specific place at a specific time will shape you to a large extent. But you can be skeptical about the usefulness of arbitrary categorizations like "generation X". First of all, time is a continuum, and slicing it up into neat portions doesn't always work so nice - as evidenced by the variety of categorizations present in this discussion. Second of all, the idea of generations understates the other formative aspects like where you live and in what environment. Once you start comparing people from various countries, it's much harder to find an overarching common theme for a "generation".

Which is why I said I don't understand why people find these categorizations so important. I never said generations didn't exist - although I guess you were taking a jab at elemtilas.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Khemehekis » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 22:43

Salmoneus wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 14:16
Wow. People so hip they don't even acknowledge the existence of time...
Must be them hipsters! Classify them as Millennials at once!
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Reyzadren » Wed 29 Aug 2018, 22:58

tbh I don't believe in these categorations by generations as I somehow have relatively few traits that match up accordingly.

I find that I have more similarities with people who actually have the same "life exposure", if anything.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by elemtilas » Thu 30 Aug 2018, 00:34

gestaltist wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 22:17
Salmoneus wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 21:51
shimobaatar wrote:
Wed 29 Aug 2018, 16:22
Not liking or agreeing with the way generations are defined is the same as not acknowledging the existence of time?
Disagreeing with the details of the way generations are defined is one thing - this thread is full of it. But claiming not to belong to a generation, or denying the existence of generations, is nonsensical.
Is it really, though? Generations, as they are defined/used in this thread are artificial constructs, shoehorning people to one category or another.
Exactly. That was one person's (considered!) opinion on the matter. Others may look at the same situations and arrive at different "generations". Some people may fit those categories and be happy with them. Others don't share those traits. The people that don't share the traits of a named construct, obviously, don't belong to that construct. Look at it this way: can we say with authority that people born 18 years aog in the deepest jungles of Brasil are "Millenials"? I don't think so.
Nobody in their right mind would deny that living in a specific place at a specific time will shape you to a large extent.
True that, but at the same time that which has shaped two specific persons in a roughly the same geographical time and place may be radically different. Hence my position on the matter of utility.

Out of all this discussion, I think Reyzadren has put the finger closest to truth.
I never said generations didn't exist - although I guess you were taking a jab at elemtilas.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Axiem » Thu 30 Aug 2018, 14:34

elemtilas wrote:
Thu 30 Aug 2018, 00:34
the deepest jungles of Brasil
It's worth noting that the original formulation of generational theory was explicitly to describe American generations.
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by this_is_an_account » Tue 04 Sep 2018, 20:56

How does one make one of those code things with the green monospace font?
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Re: (EE) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by KaiTheHomoSapien » Tue 04 Sep 2018, 21:15

this_is_an_account wrote:
Tue 04 Sep 2018, 20:56
How does one make one of those code things with the green monospace font?
The way to do it is type something up in Notepad using a monospace font (like Courier New). Then copy the text from Notepad into the "code" brackets (press the button to the right of the "quote" button in the text editor).
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