Basilese

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Shemtov
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Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

Basilese [native name <Basiles> /ba.ʃi.je/] is a Romance Language spoken in the Independent Grand Duchy of Basil, which in real-world terms, is in the Swiss Cantons of Basel-Stadt, Basel-Land and Jura, The French arrondissements of Altkirch and Mulhaus, and the German district of Lörrach and the western portions of the German districts of Waldshut and Breisgau-Hochschwarzwald including Freiburg im Breisgau. The language is in its own branch of Romance, Rhino-Romance, but has heavy influence from the Langues d'oïl.

PHONOLOGY:
/p b t d k g/ <p b t d c/ch/qu g>
/m n ɲ/ <m n/nh n>
/f v s ʃ ʒ x/ <f v s/sh/z/zh s/c/ç z/j/g x>
/ʀ/ <r>
/l/<l/lh>
/j/ <l>

/i y u/ <i u ou>
/e o/ <e/é o>
/a/ <è/a>
All vowels can be nasalized, and this is shown by being followed by a <n>

<c s n l g z > are pronounced /ʃ ʃ ɲ j ʒ ʒ/ before <i e è>. The spellings with an h following are used when they proceed these vowels but are pronounced in their normal way.
<h> exists in the orthography, but is silient.
All consonants are pronounced siliently word-finally except <f c r l x m>, unless there is a silient <e> after them. <é> is used when there is a /Ce/ sequence word-finally. <ë>is used when there is silient <e> that palatalizes a <c s n l g>.


SOUND CHANGES FROM LATIN:
/k g s z n l/>/t͡ʃ d͡ʒ ʃ ʒ ɲ ʎ/ _i _ɪ _e _ɛ
/z/>/s/
/w/>/v/
/kʷ gʷ/> /k g/
/u/>/y/
/ʊ o:/> /u/
/ɔ/>/o/
/h/>∅
/pt kt/> /t/
/ŋn/>/ɲ/
/j/>/ʒ/
/ks/>/xs/>/x/
Word final consonants except /m k t͡ʃ f r l ʎ x n/>∅
word finally /e/>/ə/>∅
/t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/>/ʃ ʒ/
/ʎ/>/j/
/Vn/>/Ṽ/
/ɛ/>/a/
/r/>/ʀ/

Numbers 1-10:
<un> /ỹ/
<du> /dy/
<très> <tra>
<quate> /kat/
<quinq> /kĩk/
<sèx> /sax/
<sèt> /sa/
<ot> /o/
<nove> /nov/
<dèsë> /daʃ/
Last edited by Shemtov on 22 Feb 2016 00:03, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Basilese

Post by masako »

So...how is this Romlang different from the multitude of others?
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Re: Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

masako wrote:So...how is this Romlang different from the multitude of others?
It's sort of in the middle of being a straight Romlang and being one with a Germanic influence. The balance between French and German influence is also very important for Basilese. In fact, an almost Nynosrk/Bokmal dichotomy has evolved, with the Duchy itself officially recognizing only the more common Roumic Lhinga, as opposed to Villic Basiles, which is used in territory north of the Rhine, and some of whose literary proponents use a different orthography, which was developed in the 1960s, when there was movement for the Vill Lhinga-speaking areas to become the independant State of Wil.
Last edited by Shemtov on 19 Feb 2016 03:06, edited 1 time in total.
Many children make up, or begin to make up, imaginary languages. I have been at it since I could write.
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Re: Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

NOUNS:
Nouns have two gender, Masculine and Feminine, two cases (though only in definite nouns), Nominative and Oblique, and two numbers, singular and plural (distinguished in the spoken language only by the articles).


Most of the Nominative morphology happens on the article, though a silent <s> is appended to plurals.

Articles are required with most non-definite nouns.

The indefinite article:
MASC.: Un
FEM: Une
PLR:Pars

Examples:
Un hom
"A man"

Une fèmin
"A woman"

Pars homs
"Some men"

Definite article:
MASC NOM: El
MASC OBL: Elo
FEM NOM: La
FEM OBL: Lo
PLR NOM: Li
PLR OBL: Lo

Examples:
El hom
"The man"

La fèmin
"The woman"

Li homs
"The men"
Many children make up, or begin to make up, imaginary languages. I have been at it since I could write.
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Re: Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

Pronouns:
Pronouns have two extra cases, Dative and Genitive:
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Thrice Xandvii
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Re: Basilese

Post by Thrice Xandvii »

I would imagine you were going for something like this with that last "chart"?

Image





(My design sense couldn't really handle looking at that other one you have there.)
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Re: Basilese

Post by Lambuzhao »

Rhino-Romance
I think this should be Rheno-Romance, b/c when I saw this, I instantly thought of
Spoiler:
Image
and checked just to be sure.

Now let's hear more!!!
[:D]
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Re: Basilese

Post by Dormouse559 »

Most of what you've got here looks fine to me, except this:
Shemtov wrote:<quinq> /kĩk/
Quinque ended up as cinque in Vulgar Latin, and you'll find that every Romance language reflects that change (except maybe Sardinian because it's crazy conservative).
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Re: Basilese

Post by Ahzoh »

Thrice Xandvii wrote:Image
That's a nice table. wonderin' if you could make me one for my pronouns...
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Re: Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

Dormouse559 wrote:Most of what you've got here looks fine to me, except this:
Shemtov wrote:<quinq> /kĩk/
Quinque ended up as cinque in Vulgar Latin, and you'll find that every Romance language reflects that change (except maybe Sardinian because it's crazy conservative).
That's OK since the main point of the numbers wasn't to show the numbers, but as an easy way to show how the orthography works.
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Re: Basilese

Post by KaiTheHomoSapien »

Dormouse559 wrote:Most of what you've got here looks fine to me, except this:
Shemtov wrote:<quinq> /kĩk/
Quinque ended up as cinque in Vulgar Latin, and you'll find that every Romance language reflects that change (except maybe Sardinian because it's crazy conservative).
The Sardinian word for 5 is "chimbe", which seems to reflect cinque (cf. "battoro" for 4--it would be "bimbe" otherwise). So yeah, even in Sardinian, cinque is reflected!

Just throwing that out there for fun--sorry to distract from the topic.
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Re: Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

THE INDICATIVE ACTIVE VERB:
The Active Indicative has four tenses: Present, Past perfect (Simple past), Past imperfect, and Future. It also conjugates for person and number.
Conjugation of very common irregular verb "Ese" "To be"/the copula:
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Re: Basilese

Post by Corphishy »

Shemtov wrote:<ë>is used when there is silient <e> that palatalizes a <c s n l g>
why would you need to use a different character when <e> is always silent word-finally and always palatalizes <c s n l g>? If it doesn't happen all the time, I still don't think it's necessary but also it could be that I really dislike <ë>
Aszev wrote:A good conlang doesn't come from pursuing uniqueness. Uniqueness is usually an effect from creating a good conlang.
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Re: Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

Corphishy wrote:
Shemtov wrote:<ë>is used when there is silient <e> that palatalizes a <c s n l g>
why would you need to use a different character when <e> is always silent word-finally and always palatalizes <c s n l g>? If it doesn't happen all the time, I still don't think it's necessary but also it could be that I really dislike <ë>
A normal silent "e" doesn't palatalize. When I said <e> palatalizes, I meant an <e> that has it's normal sound.
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Re: Basilese

Post by masako »

Vive LFN!

:lfn: :lfn: :lfn: :lfn:
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Re: Basilese

Post by Shemtov »

masako wrote:Vive LFN!

:lfn: :lfn: :lfn: :lfn:
What is the relevance?
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Re: Basilese

Post by Ahzoh »

My guess is that masako is implying a relationship between Lingua Franca Nova, maybe saying it's a clone or relex of it, or just another boring romance language.
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Re: Basilese

Post by masako »

Ahzoh wrote:My guess is that masako is implying a relationship between Lingua Franca Nova, maybe saying it's a clone or relex of it, or just another boring romance language.
You think me so harsh? I'm not suggesting a relationship or that Basilese is "just another boring romance language", but that in the pantheon of romlangs, LFN is IMHO the best out there. I know George (the creator of LFN) personally, and I happen to think that his purpose and method for LFN is quite admirable. I also think that if Shemtov wants to spend his time working on a romlang, he might do well to see what is already out there to get an idea of how others have gone about it. Not that there is only one method that works, but that being familiar with other romlangs will benefit the process in the long term.
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Re: Basilese

Post by Lambuzhao »

Although IMHO it started out as a more zonelang/auxlang, LFN is not too shabby at all.
It's a lot less clunky or byzantine than Martellotta's Latinulus or Henderson's Nov Latin, which, along with Latinesce, are among LFN's genetically closest congeners. Though LFN has far surpassed their collective half-lives.

Romlangs are just such an endless sandbox of great ideas to work on/develop/deconstruct. They have at their source some of the most (perhaps overly) documented families, subfamilies, dialects and registers of any tribe of languages; how not make a romlang?

BTW, impressed with the connection, masako~! :mrgreen: Did you study under him @ university? Did you study together?


But do keep up the work, Shemto-. Let's see what you bring about! [:)]
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Re: Basilese

Post by sangi39 »

Lambuzhao wrote:Although IMHO it started out as a more zonelang/auxlang, LFN is not too shabby at all.
It's a lot less clunky or byzantine than Martellotta's Latinulus or Henderson's Nov Latin, which, along with Latinesce, are among LFN's genetically closest congeners. Though LFN has far surpassed their collective half-lives.

Romlangs are just such an endless sandbox of great ideas to work on/develop/deconstruct. They have at their source some of the most (perhaps overly) documented families, subfamilies, dialects and registers of any tribe of languages; how not make a romlang?

BTW, impressed with the connection, masako~! :mrgreen: Did you study under him @ university? Did you study together?


But do keep up the work, Shemto-. Let's see what you bring about! [:)]
That's actually one of the main reasons I like the idea of Romlangs. They're a good way to start working on diachronic conlangs. They're well documented, the historical sound changes leading up to the various extant Romlangs are fairly well understood and the history of the area (dates, people, places) are fairly well known as well, as far as I understand. It's a nice little area to start and try and work on creating something realistic, and I think that's where some conlangers go wrong.

The attraction to Romlangs is fairly obvious, but a lot of people try to make something too "unique" and "special" so it doesn't feel like it fits in where it should any more. I seem to recall someone trying to aim for ejectives in a Romlang spoken in Switzerland once. I'm not saying you can't get ejectives in a Romlang, but isolated, surrounded by other Romance languages and Germanic languages, none of which have ejectives, it just comes of as odd and out-of-place.

And that's kind of the downside of a really good Romlang, at least in my mind. Yes, you end up with something different but it's also very clearly a Romance language so it stops looking "unique", or you have to start bending history a bit, e.g. having the Roman Empire expand a little bit further outwards, having Latin-speaking populations surviving or avoiding later influxes of non-Romance speakers, etc.

Either way, I'll always recommend trying one.
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