Quick Diachronics Challenge
- Creyeditor
- MVP
- Posts: 5091
- Joined: 14 Aug 2012 19:32
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
So, I revamped my grouping and reconstruction a bit. I feel like I am making progress, although the proto word might not be the most realistic guess.
Spoiler:
Creyeditor
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
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Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 2 3 4 4
Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
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- mayan
- Posts: 2080
- Joined: 11 Jan 2015 23:22
- Location: USA
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Is it [kʼuo̯l] or [kʼu̯ol]?
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Ah, yeah, it'd be [kʼuo̯l]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
-
- korean
- Posts: 10375
- Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
- Location: UTC-04:00
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Finally had the time to really give this a shot. I'm not very confident about the conclusions I reached, but this was fun anyway.
Looks like the board messed up some of my formatting, too. That's a shame, but I don't know what to do about it, so I'm just going to leave it.
(Post #10020).
Spoiler:
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- mayan
- Posts: 2080
- Joined: 11 Jan 2015 23:22
- Location: USA
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Here's my guess:
Spoiler:
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Creyeditor:
Shimobaatar:
GrandPiano:
I think overall, Shimobaatar is probably the closest in having a correct overview of the groupings at a lower level, probably tying with Creyeditor in terms of a proto-word (if we take Creyeditor's original proposal), while GrandPiano has grouped the languages together correctly at their highest level
Spoiler:
Shimobaatar:
Spoiler:
GrandPiano:
Spoiler:
I think overall, Shimobaatar is probably the closest in having a correct overview of the groupings at a lower level, probably tying with Creyeditor in terms of a proto-word (if we take Creyeditor's original proposal), while GrandPiano has grouped the languages together correctly at their highest level
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
- Creyeditor
- MVP
- Posts: 5091
- Joined: 14 Aug 2012 19:32
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
So, this is my third and last guess. I hope I did better with the grouping, I also tried to make some imrovements on the proto-word. I an really uncomfortable with initial voicing, but I still assumed it twice.
Spoiler:
Creyeditor
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 2 3 4 4
Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 2 3 4 4
Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Ah fudge! Sorry, Creyeditor, I appear to have misspoken. Your purple group wasn't a valid grouping. I know you said it would be your final guess, but I'd like to see what you come up with given that update, and so sorry for the mistake.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
-
- mayan
- Posts: 2080
- Joined: 11 Jan 2015 23:22
- Location: USA
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Am I allowed to take inspiration from the others’ reconstructions, or are we not supposed to look at the other guesses until after the correct answer is revealed?
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
It's up to you. I divided the replies up so it was more clear who I was talking to, but put them in spoilers in case anyone wanted to work alone.GrandPiano wrote: ↑18 Aug 2018 05:31 Am I allowed to take inspiration from the others’ reconstructions, or are we not supposed to look at the other guesses until after the correct answer is revealed?
I tend to try and work on what the OP aims at me, or shares publicly, but other people do work off of responses to other people's stuff, so really it's up to you
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
- Creyeditor
- MVP
- Posts: 5091
- Joined: 14 Aug 2012 19:32
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Okay, so instead of giving a totally new guess, I wil just modify it slightly below:
Spoiler:
Creyeditor
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 2 3 4 4
Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 2 3 4 4
Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
-
- korean
- Posts: 10375
- Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
- Location: UTC-04:00
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Just to clarify, sangi39, what exactly do you mean by "first/second/third level groupings"?
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
So, imagine that there's this type of branching:shimobaatar wrote: ↑19 Aug 2018 15:49 Just to clarify, sangi39, what exactly do you mean by "first/second/third level groupings"?
Proto-ABCD to Proto-AB to A
Proto-ABCD to Proto-AB to B
Proto-ABCD to Proto-CD to C
Proto-ABCD to Proto-CD to D
A and B would form a first level grouping, as would C and D, with Proto-AB and Proto-CD as the proto-languages. AB and CD would then form a second level grouping, with Proto-ABCD as the proto-language. A third level grouping would then be something that descends from something before Proto-ABCD, e.g. Proto-ABCDEF, with Proto-EF as a sister language to Proto-ABCD within that grouping.
Hope that helps.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Hoping to clarify that last post, since I made it at work:
Effectively the "nth level grouping" is, well, a backwards count of the number of splits between a given language, its relatives, and the proto-language. 1st level groupings have four splits between the languages that make that group and the ultimate proto-language, 2nd level groupings have three splits between the (proto)languages that make that group and the ultimate proto-language, and so on.
Sorry for any confusion there.
For a hint: the divisions between these languages are all binary, and all presented languages are the same age, each experiencing the same number of splits between them and the proto-language as all the other presented languages
Effectively the "nth level grouping" is, well, a backwards count of the number of splits between a given language, its relatives, and the proto-language. 1st level groupings have four splits between the languages that make that group and the ultimate proto-language, 2nd level groupings have three splits between the (proto)languages that make that group and the ultimate proto-language, and so on.
Sorry for any confusion there.
For a hint: the divisions between these languages are all binary, and all presented languages are the same age, each experiencing the same number of splits between them and the proto-language as all the other presented languages
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Hoping to hear from Shimobaatar and GrandPiano I've had a busy week myself, so of course no rush, just hoping there are still people working on this
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
-
- mayan
- Posts: 2080
- Joined: 11 Jan 2015 23:22
- Location: USA
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
I’ve been meaning to give it another go, but I’ve been busy lately and haven’t had much time. Hopefully I’ll be able to work on it soon.
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Well, as I said, I'm in no rush. Creyeditor has said that they've submitted their final guess, but I'm happy waiting on other guesses to come in, and hope other people are too. I'm hoping to see where people go with the comments I posted beforeGrandPiano wrote: ↑26 Aug 2018 19:43 I’ve been meaning to give it another go, but I’ve been busy lately and haven’t had much time. Hopefully I’ll be able to work on it soon.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
-
- korean
- Posts: 10375
- Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
- Location: UTC-04:00
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
School just started back up for me, so I've been pretty busy too. I'll try to give it another go soon, but if you get tired of waiting, go ahead with whatever you'd like to do.
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
Oops, I hadn't realized that there was a courtesy/convention about avoiding other people's feedback. If I'm still allowed, here's my attempt at this.
Spoiler:
Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge
As I said to GrandPiano, how much attention, if any, you pay to responses to other people's guesses is entirely up to you. I personally try to ignore them, others don't
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.