Tasarian Languages Megathread

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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

Proto-Tasarian adjectives decline for number, Gender and case:
Declension of adjective tl̩t "RED:
Masculine:
Singular:
Nominative: tl̩tar
Accusative: tl̩ta:r
Dative: tl̩tr̩
Genetive: tl̩tas
Locative: tl̩tat
Ablative: tl̩tadʱa
Lative: tl̩tɛ
Instrumental: tl̩tu
Vocative: tl̩ta:

Plural:
Nominative-Vocative: tl̩tai
Accusative: tl̩ta:i̯
Dative: tl̩t
Genetive: tl̩tais
Locative: tl̩tait
Ablative: tl̩taidʱ
Lative: tl̩tɛi
Instrumental: tl̩tɔi

Feminine:
Singular:
Nominative: tl̩ta
Accusative: tl̩ta:
Dative: tl̩ti
Genetive: tl̩tas
Locative: tl̩tat
Ablative: tl̩tadʱa
Lative: tl̩tɛ
Instrumental: tl̩tu
Vocative: tl̩ta

Plural:
Nominative-Vocative: tl̩tai
Accusative: tl̩ta:i̯
Dative: tl̩t
Genetive: tl̩tais
Locative: tl̩tait
Ablative: tl̩taidʱ
Lative: tl̩tɛi
Instrumental: tl̩tɔi

Neuter:
Singular:
Nominative: tl̩tam
Accusative: tl̩ta:m
Dative: tl̩tam̩
Genetive: tl̩taas
Locative: tl̩tat
Ablative: tl̩tadʱa
Lative: tl̩tɛ
Instrumental: tl̩tu
Vocative: tl̩ta:

Plural:
Nominative-Vocative: tl̩tai
Accusative: tl̩ta:i̯
Dative: tl̩t
Genetive: tl̩tis
Locative: tl̩tait
Ablative: tl̩taidʱ
Lative: tl̩tɛi
Instrumental: tl̩tɔi
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

Use of the Oblique Case in Forest Toisan is defined by the use of particles before the noun, as this case represents the collapse of the locative, Ablative, Lative and Instrumental cases of PT.
List of particles:
In: Mod
On: mös
Out of: arp
To: Xan
Through/with: Dok

Examples:
Tasar goirâ dok hars düsalar
"The man washed the cow with water"

Goirai arp šâfo parbalat
"The cows came from the forest"
Last edited by Shemtov on 15 Mar 2017 19:21, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

Another descendant:
/kʷ gʷ kʷʰ gʷʱ/>/k g kʰ gʱ/
/CʱV/>/CʰV:/
/r̩ l̩/>/rə lə/
/m̩ n̩/>/ə̃/
/ɛ ɔ/>/ə/
/ku̯ gu̯ kʰu̯/> /k g kʰ/
/tu̯ du̯ tʰu̯/> /p b pʰ/
/pu̯ bu̯ pʰu̯/> /pf bv pʰf/>/f v f/
/su̯/>f
/ki̯ gi̯ kʰi̯/>/c ɟ cʰ/>/t͡ʃ d͡ʒ t͡ʃʰ/
/ti̯ d̯i tʰi̯/>/t͡ʃ d͡ʒ t͡ʃʰ/>ts dz tsʰ/
/pi̯ bi pʰi̯/>/pʃ bʒ pʃʰ/>ps bz psʰ/>/s z s/
/si̯/>/ʃ/
/pʰ tʰ tsʰ t͡ʃʰ kʰ/> f θ s ʃ x/


Thus:
/p b t d ts dz t͡ʃ d͡ʒ k g/
/m n/
/f v θ s z ʃ x/
/r/
/l j w/

/i: i u: u a a: ə ə̃/
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

The moods of Forest Toisian are three: The subjunctive, the Conditional and the Imperative.
The first two can be conjugated for person and number.
Examples with "jer"to see":
Subjunctive: Âjer
Conditional: jeran
Imperitive:jeras

Conditional sentences do not require the subjunctive in the apodeisis, except if the sentence is counterfactual. Let's take a look at two examples:
Goirai arp šâfo parbanat, he jeramu
"If the cows come from the forest I will see them"

Goirai arp šâfo parbanat, he âjeru
"If the cows come from the forest [and they will not], I will see them"

Reflexive verbs take different persson and number endings then regular verbs:
1P sing: oi
1P PLR: on
2P sing: e
2P plr: os
3p sing : or
3P plr: ot

Dadüsoi
"I have washed myself"
Last edited by Shemtov on 16 Mar 2017 07:00, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

Nukian is a language spoken on the far south of the Tasarian-speaking zone; its speakers are in fact in the Kirmitite cultural zone and it contains not a few loanwords from Kirmitite.

Phonology and romanazation:
/p b t d ts dz t͡ʃ d͡ʒ k g/ <p b t d c cz ch j k g>
/m n/ <m n>
/f v θ s z ʃ x h/ <f v th s z š kh>
/r/ <r>
/l j w/ <l y w>

/i: i u: u a a: ə ə̃/ <ī i ū u a ā e ẽ>
<ai əi>
Nouns have two genders, masculine and feminine and two declensions, the Masculine declension and the Feminine declension. The former is a bit of a misnomer as it contains some feminine words.
Masculine Declension:
Example: Kret- "Stone"
Singular:
Nominative: Kretar
Accusative-Lative: Kretār
Dative-Locative: Kreter
Genetive-Ablative: Kretas
Instrumental: Kretu


Plural:
Nominative: Kretai
Accusative_Lative: Kretāy
Dative-Locative: Kret
Genetive-Ablative: Kretais
Instrumental: Kretei

The Feminine declension:
Example: Kheira"cow"
Singular:
Nominative: Kheira
Accusative-Lative: Kheirā
Dative-Locative: Kheiri
Genetive-Ablative: Kheiras
Instrumental: Kheiru
Plural:
Nominative: Kheirai
Accusative-Lative: Kheirāy
Dative-Locative: Kheir
Genetive-Ablative: Kheirais
Instrumental: Kheirei
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

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Conjugation of the active indicative verb in Nukian:
Verb "ser" to see:
Present tense:
1P sing: Seru
1P PLR: Seren
2P sing: Sere
2P plr: Seras
3p sing masc: Serer
3p sing fem: Sera
3P plr: Serat

The present progressive:
1P sing: Eseru
1P PLR: Eseren
2P sing: Esere
2P plr: Eserras
3p sing masc: Eserer
3p sing fem: Eserra
3p sing neut.Ecserem
3P plr: Eserat

Aorist:
1P sing: Serelew
1P PLR: Serelen
2P sing: Sereley
2P plr: Sereles
3p sing masc: Sereler
3p sing fem: Serela
3P plr: Serelet

Present perfect:
1P sing: Saseru
1P PLR: Saseren
2P sing: Sasere
2P plr: Saseras
3p sing masc: Saserer
3p sing fem: Saserra
3P plr: Saserat

Past Perfect:
1P sing: Saserelew
1P PLR: Saserelen
2P sing: Sasereley
2P plr: Sasereles
3p sing masc: Sasereler
3p sing fem: Saserela
3P plr: Saserelet

The Future:
1P sing: Seremew
1P PLR: Seremen
2P sing: Seremey
2P plr: Seremes
3p sing masc: Seremer
3p sing fem: Sereme
3P plr: Seremet
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

While the canonical word order in most Tasarian languages is SOV, in Nukian it is SVO.
Use of the double cases:
The accusative can become a lative, the dative a locative, and the genitive an ablative through the use of particles:
The accusative becomes a lative with the particle khan, the dative a locative by med, and the genitive an ablative with rep.
Mamar saserela rūjā
"Mother has seen a star"

Kheirai erufa khan gẽtā
"The cows are running to the stable"

Fafar dleser kheirā
"Father slaughters cows"

Sẽkelew kheirā sis
"I sacrificed a cow to the gods"
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

Back to Närẃūsarian for a second:
Adjectives decline for case, number and gender. Let's look at the adjective Tälät "red":
Masculine:
Nominative: Tälätar
Accusative: Tälätāl
Dative: Tälätär
Genetive: Tälätas
Locative: Tälätat
Instrumental: Täläto
Vocative: Tälätā
Plural:
Nominative-Vocative: Tälätai
Accusative: Tälätai
Dative: Tälät
Genetive: Tälätes
Locative: Tälätait
Instrumental: Tälätoi


Feminine:
Singular:
Nominative: Täläta
Accusative: Tälätā
Dative: Täläte
Genetive: Tälätas
Locative: Tälätat
Instrumental: Täläto
Vocative: Täläta

Plural:
Nominative-Vocative: Tälätai
Accusative: Tälätai
Dative: Tälät
Genetive: Tälätais
Locative: Tälätē
Instrumental: Tälätoi

Neuter:
Singular:
Nominative: Tälätam
Accusative: Tälätām
Dative: Tälätäm
Genetive: Tälätas
Locative: Tälätat
Instrumental: Täläto
Vocative: Tälätā

Plural:
Nominative-Vocative: Tälätai
Accusative: Tälätai
Dative: Tälät
Genetive: Tälätes
Locative: Tälätait
Instrumental: Tälätoi


Tälätā khoirā cheth dadäläthu
"I have sacraficed a red cow to the gods"
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

In Nukian, adjectives decline for gender and number, but not for case. They take the ending -ar if masculine singular, -a if feminine and -ai if plural.:
Sẽkelew tleta kheirā sis
"I sacrificed a red cow to the gods"
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by shimobaatar »

Just wanted to say that I quite like the feel of this family. How far removed, temporally speaking, are the descendants from the proto-language?

Also, the OP makes it look like there are no non-syllabic nasals in Proto-Tasarian, but that doesn't seem to be the case according to later posts.
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

shimobaatar wrote:
Also, the OP makes it look like there are no non-syllabic nasals in Proto-Tasarian, but that doesn't seem to be the case according to later posts.
Fixed! I always get a little indecisive about whether I want nasals to come before or after the stops, so sometimes I forget them. [:'(]
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

shimobaatar wrote: How far removed, temporally speaking, are the descendants from the proto-language?

.
1500-2500 years, around the same time distance between PIE and Early Greek. I want this to be an IE-like family, much like Wanian is the Austronesian of this world.
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

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Forest Toisan has no copula in the present tense:
Arm xarttasar
"I am A Stone-cutter"

However, it has a copula for the past and future:
Past:
1P sing: Šaslu
1P PLR: Šasalon
2P sing: Šasle
2P plr: Šaslas
3p sing: Šaslar
3P plr: Šaslat

Future:
1P sing: Fenamu
1P PLR: Fenamon
2P sing: Femme
2P plr: Femmas
3p sing: Femmar
3P plr: Femmat

Šaslu xarttasar
"I was a stone-cutter"
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

Forest toisan adjectives inflect for number and gender, but not case. Let's look at the declension of an adjective "Talt" "red"
Masculine singular: Taltar
Masculine plural: Taltai
Feminine singular: Talta
Feminine plural: Taltai
Neuter singular: Taltom
Neuter plural: Taltai

An example:
Taltom xartâm jajeru
"I saw the red stone"

Goirai arp talta beso parbat
"The cows are coming from the red barn"
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

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Proto-Tasarian Numerals:
1-10:
1. Dn̩
2. Pɔt
3. Mɛi̯t
4. iu̯
5. ɛdʱ
6. Bɔi̯t
7. N̩dna
8. i:t
9. Kʷʰɛk
10. N̩kʷi:

Numbers 11-19 are formed by putting the suffix u̯i after the number:
Dn̩u̯i "Eleven"

The 10s are formed by putting the suffix N̩k or nk after each number. The exception is twenty, which is simply Pɔtn̩
Example:
Bɔi̯tn̩k "Sixty"

The numbers in between are formed by putting the ones place followed by *l̩ followed by the tens place:
Kʷʰɛk l̩ bɔi̯tn̩k
"69"

Ordinal numbers are formed by the suffix -us:
Kʷʰɛk l̩ bɔi̯tn̩kus
"69th"
The exceptions are first and second, with first being Bi̯ɛtus and second being Pr̩stus


Whether a plain number or an ordinal, some categories require Meseure words between the number and the item.
The main three measure words are "Tas" for people, "Bʱak" for animals and "kr̩l" for man made objects:
N̩dna tas sr̩i̯ai
"Seven priests"
Last edited by Shemtov on 17 May 2017 08:00, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

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Närẃūsarian cardinal numerals:
1. Dän
2. Pot
3. Mēt
4. Ew
5. Eth
6. Boyt
7. Anna
8. It
9. Phek
10. Ampi

Numbers 11 and twelve have the unuasual forms Jetwe and Prästwe
Numbers 13-19 are formed by adding the suffix -we

The Tens
20 Potnäk
3. Mētnäk
4. Ewnäk
5. Ethnäk
6. Boytnät
7. Annank
8. Itnäk
9. Pheknäk


Numbers in between are formed like this:
Phek lä Boytnät
"69"

In between a number and a noun a measure word is inserted.
Examples of MWs:
Tas for "people"
Phāk for "Domestic animals"
Änta for "Birds"
Sräs for "Insects"
Kräl for "workers tools"
Thōl for "Weapons"
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

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Närẃūsarian ordinal numbers are formed by turning the number into an adjective. No measure words are required.
Let's compare:
Märtanäläw anna tas sräyai
"I killed seven priests"

Märtanäläw annāl sräyar
"I killed the seventh priest"
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

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The Toisan languages have done away with measure words entirely. In forest Toisan, Numerals are treated as adjectives.

Proto-Tasarian Numerals:
1-10:
1. Danar
2. Potai
3. Mɛtai
4. Üai
5. Edai
6. Bötai
7. Nanai
8. Itai
9. Fekai
10. Nafiai

Numbers 11-19 are formed by putting the suffix ü after the number:

Danüai "Eleven"

The 10s are formed by putting the suffix Nak or ank after each number. The exception is twenty, which is simply Potanai
Example:
Bötnakai "Sixty"

The numbers in between are formed by putting the ones place followed by *l̩ followed by the tens place:
Fek la bötnakai
"69"

Jeralu nanai srayâi
"I saw seven priests"
Last edited by Shemtov on 17 May 2017 07:59, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by shimobaatar »

Shemtov wrote:Numbers 11-12 are formed by putting the suffix u̯i after the number:
Dn̩u̯i "Eleven"

The 10s are formed by putting the suffix N̩k or nk after each number. The exception is twenty, which is simply Pɔtn̩
Example:
Bɔi̯tn̩k "Sixty"

The numbers in between are formed by putting the ones place followed by *l̩ followed by the tens place:
Kʷʰɛk l̩ bɔi̯tn̩k
"69"
What about the numbers 13-19? Would 13, for example, just be "Mɛi̯t l̩ n̩kʷi:"?
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Re: Tasarian Languages Megathread

Post by Shemtov »

shimobaatar wrote:
Shemtov wrote:Numbers 11-12 are formed by putting the suffix u̯i after the number:
Dn̩u̯i "Eleven"

The 10s are formed by putting the suffix N̩k or nk after each number. The exception is twenty, which is simply Pɔtn̩
Example:
Bɔi̯tn̩k "Sixty"

The numbers in between are formed by putting the ones place followed by *l̩ followed by the tens place:
Kʷʰɛk l̩ bɔi̯tn̩k
"69"
What about the numbers 13-19? Would 13, for example, just be "Mɛi̯t l̩ n̩kʷi:"?
I meant 11-19. I'll go fix that.
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