(Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here [2010-2020]
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
There are at least a couple of definitions of the concept of a "vowel".
A vowel can be:
(1) A sound that is produced with an open vowel tract - that is, with no significant blocking or obstruction that prevents the air from passing freely through the mouth.
(2) A sound that is the most sonorous sound in the syllable.
Those sounds that are most typically referred to as "vowel", are vowels in both of the above senses: [y] [ɒ] [ə] [ɨ] etc.
Semivowels - [j] [w] and a few more - are vowels according to definition (1), but not according to definition (2).
Syllabic consonants - [n̩] [r̩] [s̩] etc. - are vowels according to definition (2), but not according to definition (1).
"Pure" (non-syllabic) consonants - [tʰ] [f] [sʷ] [q] etc. - are vowels in neither of the above senses.
See also this nice little chart.
A vowel can be:
(1) A sound that is produced with an open vowel tract - that is, with no significant blocking or obstruction that prevents the air from passing freely through the mouth.
(2) A sound that is the most sonorous sound in the syllable.
Those sounds that are most typically referred to as "vowel", are vowels in both of the above senses: [y] [ɒ] [ə] [ɨ] etc.
Semivowels - [j] [w] and a few more - are vowels according to definition (1), but not according to definition (2).
Syllabic consonants - [n̩] [r̩] [s̩] etc. - are vowels according to definition (2), but not according to definition (1).
"Pure" (non-syllabic) consonants - [tʰ] [f] [sʷ] [q] etc. - are vowels in neither of the above senses.
See also this nice little chart.
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
I think this will solve your problem.Batrachus wrote:How can I normally (no copy-pasting and no Maor etc. keyboards) write special letters, like the macron ones? I tried Alt+number, but it only works up to 256 and first 32 are even not the same as in neither ASCII nor UTF-8.
Colourless green ideas sleep furiously
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
I solved this by making myself a Greasemonkey replacing script
EDIT: very buggy and impractical script
EDIT: very buggy and impractical script
:ces: Native
Mutually intelligibile with native language
Almost fluent
Little
Little more
Everybody can speak it!
Speedlang
Mutually intelligibile with native language
Almost fluent
Little
Little more
Everybody can speak it!
Speedlang
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Let Fanaelesz make the Compose Key For Windows stuff.Batrachus wrote:How can I normally (no copy-pasting and no Maor etc. keyboards) write special letters, like the macron ones? I tried Alt+number, but it only works up to 256 and first 32 are even not the same as in neither ASCII nor UTF-8.
Thrice the brinded cat hath mew'd.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
I wonder if it's possible for a general hortative mood marking to split into imperative and a sort of adhortative through merging with Japanese-style honourifics (and their opposite, whatever that may be called)?
<äʒƺçķļ>
<áéíóú>
<áéíóú>
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Ain't gonna happen in the foreseeable future, the Windows' keypress-to-character APIs are so fucked up I ain't touching 'em with a ten foot pole.Milyamd wrote:Let Fanaelesz make the Compose Key For Windows stuff.Batrachus wrote:How can I normally (no copy-pasting and no Maor etc. keyboards) write special letters, like the macron ones? I tried Alt+number, but it only works up to 256 and first 32 are even not the same as in neither ASCII nor UTF-8.
Perhaps if the PostMessage(WM_{,SYS}KEY{UP,DOWN})+TranslateMessage hack works, but I can't be bothered to test it.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
1. What exactly do you mean?hubris_incalculable wrote:I wonder if it's possible for a general hortative mood marking to split into imperative and a sort of adhortative through merging with Japanese-style honourifics (and their opposite, whatever that may be called)?
2. Some examples of what you mean, (and also perhaps of some near-misses to tell us what you don't mean), would help us undertand the question.
3. Have you looked at http://wals.info/feature/72A, http://wals.info/feature/79B, and http://wals.info/feature/70A, (and perhaps other features near or between them), to see what natlangs do? It might be better to read the chapters than the features, though; http://wals.info/chapter/72 and http://wals.info/chapter/70, maybe also http://wals.info/chapter/79. Maybe you'd like to read all of chapters 70 through 78.
@Micamo, your answer convinces me, but I don't think it's to Creyeditor's point.Micamo wrote:Actually, in theory anyway, the analysis of a lang without phonemic vowels doesn't depend on how many clusters the language allows or their frequency. What matters is contrast: Are there minimal pairs that differ only the presence or the quality of a vowel? If there aren't, then a case can be made that the language lacks phonemic vowels underlyingly, regardless of which vowels in which positions appear phonetically.Creyeditor wrote:Nuxalk is probably as close as you can get and Idon't remember the name of engelang/conlang that consisited only of vowels. It was labeled "crazy" by its inventor(s).
You talked about how a 'lang might have no phonemic vowels.
Creyeditor was talking about a 'lang that had only phonemic vowels.
Edit: If I'd read all the way through the most recent 20 posts on this thread I could have found out it started with Brawner_Williams's question which mentioned both a 'lang without and a 'lang with only vowels; and that before Creyeditor's response you'd already talked about 'langs with only vowels. Sorry.
My minicity is http://gonabebig1day.myminicity.com/xml
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
and used the Subjunctive Mood for Hortatory purposes.hubris_incalculable wrote:I wonder if it's possible for a general hortative mood marking to split into imperative and a sort of adhortative through merging with Japanese-style honourifics (and their opposite, whatever that may be called)?
It survives in :spa: today in those sorts of commands that are more like polite invitations.
E.g. Que vaya Ud. [SBJV] "You should go"
vs
Vete [IMPTV] "Scram!" "Get out!"
Because of the more invitational nature of the Subjunctive, it would lend itself to more diplomatic/honorific/humble spheres of communication.
I could see an interweaving of hortatory (subjunctives) and honorifics in a .
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Does this diagram help?eldin raigmore wrote:1. What exactly do you mean?hubris_incalculable wrote:I wonder if it's possible for a general hortative mood marking to split into imperative and a sort of adhortative through merging with Japanese-style honourifics (and their opposite, whatever that may be called)?
That was the idea.Lambuzhao wrote:I could see an interweaving of hortatory (subjunctives) and honorifics in a .
Last edited by hubris_incalculable on 04 Mar 2013 04:42, edited 1 time in total.
<äʒƺçķļ>
<áéíóú>
<áéíóú>
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
I refer you to the precative mood.hubris_incalculable wrote:I wonder if it's possible for a general hortative mood marking to split into imperative and a sort of adhortative through merging with Japanese-style honourifics (and their opposite, whatever that may be called)?
任何事物的发展都是物极必反,否极泰来。
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
That works, I guess.Trailsend wrote:I refer you to the precative mood.hubris_incalculable wrote:I wonder if it's possible for a general hortative mood marking to split into imperative and a sort of adhortative through merging with Japanese-style honourifics (and their opposite, whatever that may be called)?
<äʒƺçķļ>
<áéíóú>
<áéíóú>
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
To me that seems quite reasonable. But if there is no formal difference between hortative and +honorafic, no different category has to be postulated. It's just honorafic in an imperative clause.hubris_incalculable wrote:
My meta-thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5760
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Yes it does! Quite a bit. Thanks.hubris_incalculable wrote:Does this diagram help?eldin raigmore wrote:1. What exactly do you mean?
http://img.ie/z5r0r.png
My minicity is http://gonabebig1day.myminicity.com/xml
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
I got me a question about auxiliaries. If I use a verbal auxiliary for notions like "reflexive voice", "reciprocal voice" or "inchoativity" and that auxiliary comes from ordinary intransitive-transitive pairs, should I always use the transitive one or match transitivity (when applicable)?
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
That depends: Are the sources still used as regular verbs in the language? If so, use only the transitive bases as auxiliaries. If they only have auxiliary function, then match the transitivity of the main verb.MrKrov wrote:I got me a question about auxiliaries. If I use a verbal auxiliary for notions like "reflexive voice", "reciprocal voice" or "inchoativity" and that auxiliary comes from ordinary intransitive-transitive pairs, should I always use the transitive one or match transitivity (when applicable)?
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
It is the first and ok, gracias.
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
How normal is it for [?] to be an allophone of /:/?
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
What is /:/? Do you mean a long sound?Fanael wrote:How normal is it for [?] to be an allophone of /:/?
I think I wouldn't recognize if somebody once said [la?ki] instead of [lak:i] in Finnish. (Supposing ? is the glottal stop)
My meta-thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5760
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Yes.Omzinesý wrote:What is /:/? Do you mean a long sound?
Yes.Omzinesý wrote:Supposing ? is the glottal stop
Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Sorry for the lateness in responding.
1) http://img.ie/z5r0r.png =
2) Eagerly awaiting to see how it plays out in your
1) http://img.ie/z5r0r.png =
2) Eagerly awaiting to see how it plays out in your