The last part of the Mee word could be considered a false cognate of 見た mita "saw".
In fact, the whole word looks very similar to 遠く見た tooku mita "saw far away".
The last part of the Mee word could be considered a false cognate of 見た mita "saw".
Dropping first- and second-person pronouns is really common. Dropping third-person pronouns is rarer but does still happen, and it would be understood perfectly as long as the subject of the sentence didn't change. If it did, that could get confusing, although even then people would almost certainly understand since it would be obvious that you're not a native speaker and could piece together that you were an overzealous pronoun-dropper.Alessio wrote: ↑25 Dec 2017 18:38I was thinking that something like "he is" would be rendered as он /on/ in Russian, which means just "he" and implies "is", whereas in Finnish you could render it as on, which means just "is" and implies "he/she/it" (and is of course unrelated to он). Still, at least in the spoken language, Suomea Suomeksi says that dropping pronouns is not very common, so most people would go with hän on instead.
I guess that's a normative rule of Standard Finnish, kirjakieli. In spoken language dropping 1st and 2nd person pronouns isn't that usual, even when they are not emphasised. Short pronouns mä sä me te appear quite frequently. On the other hand 3rd person pronouns can be dropped more frequently than in kirjakieli, if the topic is fixed. Nobody has still found put the rules of pronoun usage in spoken Finnish. The arbitrary norms of kirjakieli make the case even trickier when rules are borrowed between registers. The thing is however somehow fixing the discourse topic and maintaining coherence in the text.Vlürch wrote: ↑31 Dec 2017 17:22Dropping first- and second-person pronouns is really common. Dropping third-person pronouns is rarer but does still happen, and it would be understood perfectly as long as the subject of the sentence didn't change. If it did, that could get confusing, although even then people would almost certainly understand since it would be obvious that you're not a native speaker and could piece together that you were an overzealous pronoun-dropper.Alessio wrote: ↑25 Dec 2017 18:38I was thinking that something like "he is" would be rendered as он /on/ in Russian, which means just "he" and implies "is", whereas in Finnish you could render it as on, which means just "is" and implies "he/she/it" (and is of course unrelated to он). Still, at least in the spoken language, Suomea Suomeksi says that dropping pronouns is not very common, so most people would go with hän on instead.
Personally, I feel like the "rule" that third-person pronouns shouldn't be dropped feels more like a guide to kids or learners than an actual grammatical rule or even a descriptive fact. I mean, there are circumstances where it would sound stranger to use the pronoun than it would to drop it. For example, when answering questions. If someone asks "onko Trump Amerikan presidentti?" (is Trump the president of America?), you wouldn't say "hän on" (he is). You'd just say "on" (is). You might say "on hän" (he is (literally "is he")) if the person asking the question was doubtful of Trump being the president of America rather than simply asking a yes-no question or something like that. Informally, of course, you'd use "se" (it) instead of "hän" (he/she).
But yeah, as a general rule, you can drop first- and second- but not third-person pronouns.
Well, yeah, but the point should be that since in puhekieli it makes no difference at all whether the first- and second-person pronouns are dropped or not even in the subtle way it does in kirjakieli, it won't hurt anyone to drop them (or not drop them). You're right, though, and I probably should've mentioned that as well. I think the choice of whether a pronoun is dropped happens on a case-by-case basis, the brain somehow deciding which is better in a split second or something...Omzinesý wrote: ↑01 Jan 2018 01:40I guess that's a normative rule of Standard Finnish, kirjakieli. In spoken language dropping 1st and 2nd person pronouns isn't that usual, even when they are not emphasised. Short pronouns mä sä me te appear quite frequently. On the other hand 3rd person pronouns can be dropped more frequently than in kirjakieli, if the topic is fixed. Nobody has still found put the rules of pronoun usage in spoken Finnish. The arbitrary norms of kirjakieli make the case even trickier when rules are borrowed between registers. The thing is however somehow fixing the discourse topic and maintaining coherence in the text.
On a similar note, Icelandic sími, for "telephone", comes from an old word for "rope", IIRC, and I don't think it's cognate to the Ancient Greek word.Imralu wrote: ↑08 Jan 2018 01:28 Swahili simu "telephone", "phone call" is not from SIM but from Persian سیم (sim, "coins", "wire"). In Comorian, a language closely related to Swahili, it means "telegram". In Persian, it's ultimately a borrowing from Ancient Greek and the modern word ασήμι asími "silver" is cognate with it.
I would add Cream to that, as it goes back to PIE *(s)krama- while κάρμα goes to *(s)ker, though it is possible that there was a (pre?)-PIE root *(s)kr that took null-grade and an affix *ama on one hand and e-grade on the other. Is it possible the goes back to a PU contact with a IE lang (maybe Iranian?)?
I don’t know if any European languages have had it as a consistent sound change, but Latin had d > l as an irregular change for at least one word: *dingua > lingua “tongue”. (Though this apparently occurred due to influence from lingere “to lick”)Creyeditor wrote: ↑08 Feb 2018 01:50 To me German Weide willow and English willow, look like they should be related, but I guess they aren't? *d>l is so frequent in Papua but it seems to be non-existant in Europe, IINM.
InterestingGrandPiano wrote: ↑08 Feb 2018 05:31I don’t know if any European languages have had it as a consistent sound change, but Latin had d > l as an irregular change for at least one word: *dingua > lingua “tongue”. (Though this apparently occurred due to influence from lingere “to lick”)Creyeditor wrote: ↑08 Feb 2018 01:50 To me German Weide willow and English willow, look like they should be related, but I guess they aren't? *d>l is so frequent in Papua but it seems to be non-existant in Europe, IINM.
I make it a point to not make any of my conlangs too similar to English, and none of my conlangs are spoken on an alternate earth. So it wouldn't be a direct borrowing.Thrice Xandvii wrote: ↑08 Feb 2018 10:05Since it's a conlang, and you know English, how can you be sure the word wasn't coined as a direct borrowing or somesuch?