(L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here [2010-2019]

A forum for discussing linguistics or just languages in general.
User avatar
qwed117
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4094
Joined: 20 Nov 2014 02:27

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by qwed117 »

Where is Gandalf? For I much desire to speak with him

For is an independent clause. It can be separated as a sentence.
Spoiler:
My minicity is [http://zyphrazia.myminicity.com/xml]Zyphrazia and [http://novland.myminicity.com/xml]Novland.

Minicity has fallen :(
The SqwedgePad
User avatar
eldin raigmore
korean
korean
Posts: 6352
Joined: 14 Aug 2010 19:38
Location: SouthEast Michigan

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by eldin raigmore »

qwed117 wrote:Where is Gandalf? For I much desire to speak with him
qwed117 wrote:It can be separated as a sentence.
Yes.

qwed117 wrote:For is an independent clause.
No.
User avatar
qwed117
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4094
Joined: 20 Nov 2014 02:27

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by qwed117 »

eldin raigmore wrote:
qwed117 wrote:Where is Gandalf? For I much desire to speak with him
qwed117 wrote:For is an independent clause.

No.

You know what I mean. "For" sets up an independent clause.
Spoiler:
My minicity is [http://zyphrazia.myminicity.com/xml]Zyphrazia and [http://novland.myminicity.com/xml]Novland.

Minicity has fallen :(
The SqwedgePad
User avatar
Dormouse559
moderator
moderator
Posts: 2945
Joined: 10 Nov 2012 20:52
Location: California

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Dormouse559 »

I agree with qwed's solution, but if you want to suggest a shorter pause, the version with a comma and a period will work, too. It's clear that "Where is Gandalf" is a question, so there's no ambiguity, even without a question mark.
User avatar
kiwikami
roman
roman
Posts: 1203
Joined: 26 May 2012 17:24
Location: Oh, I don't know, I'm probably around here somewhere.

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by kiwikami »

Dormouse559 wrote:I agree with qwed's solution, but if you want to suggest a shorter pause, the version with a comma and a period will work, too. It's clear that "Where is Gandalf" is a question, so there's no ambiguity, even without a question mark.
This makes sense. Thanks!
Edit: Substituted a string instrument for a French interjection.

:eng: :mrgreen: | :fra: [:)] | ASL [:S] | :deu: [:|] | :tan: [:(] | :nav: [:'(]
User avatar
Thrice Xandvii
runic
runic
Posts: 2698
Joined: 25 Nov 2012 10:13
Location: Carnassus

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Thrice Xandvii »

One of the reasons that I like Spanish.

You can do things like: I really like Shannon, ¿where is she? Which might have made the above example less of an issue.
Image
User avatar
Lao Kou
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 5089
Joined: 25 Nov 2012 10:39
Location: 蘇州/苏州

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Lao Kou »

KaiTheHomoSapien wrote:Ah yes, biáng. Love that one. It needs to be added to the font!

I love 齉 personally (nàng, meaning "snuffling, speaking with a blocked nose", sounds like onomatopoeia?), and this one is in unicode.
Both of which may be found together on this page [o.O]
道可道,非常道
名可名,非常名
User avatar
KaiTheHomoSapien
greek
greek
Posts: 641
Joined: 15 Feb 2016 06:10
Location: Northern California

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by KaiTheHomoSapien »

Lao Kou wrote:
KaiTheHomoSapien wrote:Ah yes, biáng. Love that one. It needs to be added to the font!

I love 齉 personally (nàng, meaning "snuffling, speaking with a blocked nose", sounds like onomatopoeia?), and this one is in unicode.
Both of which may be found together on this page [o.O]
Uh oh, you caught me [:$]

Yes, I remember finding that page years ago from Googling "most complex Chinese character" (though I don't only like the complex ones, but some of them, like nàng, have a special beauty to them). Maybe a new dictionary needs to come out, subtitled: "from yī to biáng". [:P]
Image
User avatar
Thrice Xandvii
runic
runic
Posts: 2698
Joined: 25 Nov 2012 10:13
Location: Carnassus

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Thrice Xandvii »

Are there languages that do not possess any rounded vowels in their inventories but do include back vowels? If so, do they usually pop up on allophony? Are there any where they don't even appear there?
Image
User avatar
eldin raigmore
korean
korean
Posts: 6352
Joined: 14 Aug 2010 19:38
Location: SouthEast Michigan

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by eldin raigmore »

Thrice Xandvii wrote:Are there languages that do not possess any rounded vowels in their inventories but do include back vowels?.... (plus questions I can't answer)....
Alawa, Jaqaru, Nimboran, and Nunggubuyu, do not have any rounded vowels.
Alawa has one back vowel, a near-close back unrounded vowel.
Jaqaru has one back vowel, a close back unrounded vowel.
Nimboran has two back vowels, a close back unrounded vowel and a mid back unrounded vowel.
Nunggubuyu has one back vowel, a near-close back unrounded vowel.

All that according to UPSID Sound Selection.
User avatar
Thrice Xandvii
runic
runic
Posts: 2698
Joined: 25 Nov 2012 10:13
Location: Carnassus

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Thrice Xandvii »

There seems to be a paucity of information on those, but thanks!
Image
User avatar
Creyeditor
MVP
MVP
Posts: 5091
Joined: 14 Aug 2012 19:32

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Creyeditor »

I think there is a free source on Nimboran, a book by AnceauxPDF. The problem is that we do not really know if this is unrounded vowels or Japanese-style compressed rounded vowels.
Creyeditor
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 :deu: 2 :eng: 3 :idn: 4 :fra: 4 :esp:
:con: Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
[<3] Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics [<3]
User avatar
Frislander
mayan
mayan
Posts: 2088
Joined: 14 May 2016 18:47
Location: The North

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Frislander »

There's also Matsés: on the grammar pile the author is pretty clear that there's no rounding in the language, though confusingly they opt to use the rounded sybols for the back vowels, presumably for reasons of diacritical economy. (incidentally this means that the language contrasts /i ɨ ɯ/ but has no /u/).
User avatar
Omzinesý
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4080
Joined: 27 Aug 2010 08:17
Location: nowhere [naʊhɪɚ]

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Omzinesý »

Is there any language written with the Romance alphabet whit a letter z with a hook below it, like there is <ş> in Turkish and Romanian.
My meta-thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5760
User avatar
Axiem
sinic
sinic
Posts: 316
Joined: 10 Sep 2016 06:56

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Axiem »

Wikipedia mentions Middle High German. I can't, however, link to the exact Wikipedia page because phpBB can't handle it.
Conworld: Mto
:con: : Kuvian
User avatar
Creyeditor
MVP
MVP
Posts: 5091
Joined: 14 Aug 2012 19:32

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Creyeditor »

Omzinesý wrote:Is there any language written with the Romance alphabet whit a letter z with a hook below it, like there is <ş> in Turkish and Romanian.
Middle High German tailed z actually looks more like ⟨ʒ⟩.
Creyeditor
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 :deu: 2 :eng: 3 :idn: 4 :fra: 4 :esp:
:con: Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
[<3] Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics [<3]
User avatar
esoanem
hieroglyphic
hieroglyphic
Posts: 40
Joined: 05 Sep 2017 14:03
Location: Cambridge, UK
Contact:

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by esoanem »

Also isn't that just the shape of the letter z? I assumed Omzinesý wanted a language that contrasted z and z̧
My pronouns are they/them/their

:gbr: native | :esp: advanced | :deu: intermediate | :fra: intermediate | :rus: basic | :ell: lapsed | :navi: lapsed | :con: making a bunch
User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 3024
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by sangi39 »

The Middle High German example might not be accurate, since, again according to Wikipedia, it wasn't used in the writing of Middle High German at the time it was actually spoken, and the use of <z> vs. <ȥ> (z-hook, different from z-cedilla <>) is a modern development, with the latter indicating /s/ (from earlier /t/ undergoing Phase 1 of the HGCS) and the former representing /ts/ (from earlier /t/ undergoing Phase 2 of the HGCS). In original Middle High German texts, <ȥ> appears as either <z> or <s>.

Annoyingly, I've not been able to find any examples of z-cedilla being used at all in languages that use the Latin alphabet. The only real examples I've found are from French websites linking to the Permanent Committee on Geographical Names for British Official Use, which establishes "standard names for places outside the UK, for the use of the British government", where it's used to transcribe <ظ> in Arabic, Balochi, Pashto, Urdu and Persian, which you can find here.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
User avatar
Thrice Xandvii
runic
runic
Posts: 2698
Joined: 25 Nov 2012 10:13
Location: Carnassus

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Thrice Xandvii »

Axiem wrote:Wikipedia mentions Middle High German. I can't, however, link to the exact Wikipedia page because phpBB can't handle it.
All links can be posted here, you just have to stick it in a converter first to get it in hex/URL code first: like when you see %40, etc. in URLs.
Image
User avatar
Axiem
sinic
sinic
Posts: 316
Joined: 10 Sep 2016 06:56

Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Axiem »

Base: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ȥ

Attempt: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C8%A4

As link.



....that only took a half-dozen attempts. But it's working!
Conworld: Mto
:con: : Kuvian
Locked