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PostPosted: Thu 16 Sep 2010, 09:15 
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I think the problem here more or less just has to do with where in Russia place Chechnya, i.e. the European side or the Asian side. Most Western maps place Chechnya within European Russia while a minority don't include any of Russia in Europe at all, defining it entirely as an Asian state. According to one map on Wikipedia showing divisions between Asia and Europe, the Russian state places Chechnya within the Asian sectors, apparently in place since the mid-18th Century marked out by the Kuma-Manych Depression.

So, in general "no" would, IMO, be an acceptable answer if one were to leave out disputed regions of the European territories. After that, the answer depends on where you place the divide. MrKrov, as with the Kuma-Manych Depression divide and a few others, doesn't, thus the answer is "no". Sano does, thus the answer is "yes". IMO, though, the fact that the exact location of Chechnya either within Europe and Asia iis disputed means there will equally be disputes over either answer.

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PostPosted: Thu 16 Sep 2010, 12:55 
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Sangi,

You make an extremely fair point, and considering that the question itself "Is there a European language which has uvular stops?" is very open ended in that "European" is a geographic term more than a linguistic one (except of course for IE or PIE), it stands to reason that conflicting answers might result.


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PostPosted: Thu 16 Sep 2010, 17:15 
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Thanks for the answers. It occurred to me as well that Greenlandic (Kalaallisut) also has /q/, and while Greenland is geographically closer to North America, it its politically European owing to its Danish rulership.


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PostPosted: Fri 17 Sep 2010, 01:20 
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Does the German word 'ziemlich' have anything to do with the English word 'timely'?

Wiktionary says to compare with Old Norse 'bysna-', but it doesn't say why.

The Grimm Dictionary suggests an original meaning of 'ziemlich' as 'honestus, decens' in Latin and the Old English words 'dafen' and 'dafenlic' seem to fit this meaning, but not 'timlice'.


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PostPosted: Wed 29 Sep 2010, 01:32 
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English timely is derived from 'time'. German ziemlich is derived from 'ziemen' which is related to the IE word for house/build. So no, not related.

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PostPosted: Thu 07 Oct 2010, 01:06 
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Do you know some where i can find documentation on adverbs , or languages wich do not difference them from nouns or verbs?


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PostPosted: Sat 09 Oct 2010, 07:06 
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What are the main functional differences between the desiderative and optative moods?

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PostPosted: Sat 09 Oct 2010, 13:53 
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Micamo wrote:
What are the main functional differences between the desiderative and optative moods?


from the wiki: Whereas the optative expresses hopes, the desiderative mood expresses wishes and desires. Desires are what we want to be the case; hope generally implies optimism toward the chances of a desire's fulfillment. If someone desires something but is pessimistic about its chances of occurring, then one desires it but does not hope for it.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Oct 2010, 13:18 
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Although, linguistical terms are only the names we made up for certain things. If two languages have a mood the linguistics named optative it doesn't actually mean these moods are the same. Optative is just the most common term used for moods that have something to do with hopes/wishes/desires. But if we take Ancient Greek for instance, the optative does much more than just express a wish. It can indeed express a wish that can be accomplished (Optativus Cupitativus), it can express a possibility, humble opinion or request (Optativus Potentialis), it can also be uses in stead of a subjunctive or indicative in some constructions. Now all these functions are used in different constructions, but they all use the same mood, that some linguist called optative. I doubt any other language has a mood that is exactly the same.

My point is, the linguistical term for a certain thing only vaguely expresses its meaning. The specific use of all the moods found throughout the worlds languages that have been named 'optative' will be different. I doubt whether there is a real difference between the optative and the desirative, some linguist just didn't want to call a certain mood in a certain language optative, maybe he had a good reason too, maybe he was researching some language that actually had two different moods for these things, but I'm sure there are many languages that have a mood that can express 'wishes and desires' in which it's just called optative.


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Oct 2010, 16:55 
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Ossicone wrote:
Micamo wrote:
How does Inyauk form the optative mood? I'm guessing it's somewhere in xinuxúpalak.


Yes and no. I has a merged optative and desiderative. I abbreviate it DES. So it's the xinu- of xinuxúpalak.


Indeed. :-)
I believe this how the question arose.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Oct 2010, 17:47 
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Ossicone wrote:
Ossicone wrote:
Micamo wrote:
How does Inyauk form the optative mood? I'm guessing it's somewhere in xinuxúpalak.


Yes and no. I has a merged optative and desiderative. I abbreviate it DES. So it's the xinu- of xinuxúpalak.


Indeed. :-)
I believe this how the question arose.


I wondered if I could merge the optative and desiderative as well but it appears I should not.

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PostPosted: Sun 10 Oct 2010, 18:14 
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It all depends on what you want. It's unreasonable for the to be separate and it's no crazy for them to be together.
I know I'm still working out the moods in Inyauk.

I just realized that I read your first question wrong anyway. :oops:

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PostPosted: Mon 11 Oct 2010, 00:23 
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Is there some word for things like an Umlaut, but for consonants? You know, like stem alternation?


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PostPosted: Mon 11 Oct 2010, 00:38 
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Avo wrote:
Is there some word for things like an Umlaut, but for consonants? You know, like stem alternation?

Do you mean this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trema_(diacritic)

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PostPosted: Mon 11 Oct 2010, 06:05 
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Avo wrote:
Is there some word for things like an Umlaut, but for consonants? You know, like stem alternation?

Consonant gradation/mutation.

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PostPosted: Mon 11 Oct 2010, 06:14 
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Maximillian wrote:
Avo wrote:
Is there some word for things like an Umlaut, but for consonants? You know, like stem alternation?

Consonant gradation/mutation.


The right term for vowels is ablaut right? Or am I losing it?

EDIT: Nvm. The wiki confirms I am losing it.

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PostPosted: Mon 11 Oct 2010, 16:04 
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Thank you two, consonant gradiation was the word. :)


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PostPosted: Mon 11 Oct 2010, 20:16 
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Ossicone wrote:
The right term for vowels is ablaut right?

Ablaut, umlaut, inlaut... It depends on the situation.

Avo wrote:
Thank you two, consonant gradiation was the word. :)

You're welcome. ;-)

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PostPosted: Wed 13 Oct 2010, 02:51 
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Are there any attested examples of devoiced vowels, allophonic or otherwise?

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PostPosted: Wed 13 Oct 2010, 03:01 
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Micamo wrote:
Are there any attested examples of devoiced vowels, allophonic or otherwise?

This?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_p ... #Devoicing

There are other languages too, but I am lazy.

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Pumaki nimuśim śima'a na ami nimuśim ara'a. Hini nihrasum i'aku tumra urukani na nihrasum sanik hraspir.


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