Guess the Word in Romlangs

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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by zyma »

Jackk wrote: 05 Nov 2018 22:59 Woo! I had *blooming forest in my head but didn't feel like it was idiomatic [:D]

I'll have a quick think to come up with one from Boral 😀
Oh, would you consider that idiomatic? I derived the participle from this verb.

Re: "blooming", I call what I think of plants as doing most notably in spring "blooming". I'd probably describe them as "budding" during the transitional period between late winter and early spring. I just meant that it doesn't sound right to me to apply "blooming", or "budding" for that matter, to a noun like "forest" or "woodland" that refers to a group of plants. But it doesn't matter. Different people speak differently, nothing new.

Jackk wrote: 05 Nov 2018 23:07 OK, my puzzle

l'entrig broðiar - verb phrase

Example:
Il broðin tojorn l'entrig.
They always X.
Is l'entrig a noun with a definite article?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by Jackk »

shimobaatar wrote: 05 Nov 2018 23:20 Is l'entrig a noun with a definite article?
Indeed.
Phonemic transcription, not that it helps: [:D]
/lɛn'tʁaj bro'ðjaʁ/
terram impūram incolāmus
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let us live in a dirty world
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by zyma »

This is probably just a wild guess, but is l'entrig related to "enter" in any way?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

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shimobaatar wrote: 06 Nov 2018 13:52 This is probably just a wild guess, but is l'entrig related to "enter" in any way?
Only in that the en- from both words descends ultimately from PIE *h1en- "in".
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by zyma »

Well, it's something!

Do both words have ancestors in Classical Latin?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

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shimobaatar wrote: 06 Nov 2018 14:47 Do both words have ancestors in Classical Latin?
hmm
entrig is a deverbal of a verb entrighar which does have a direct ancestor in Classical Latin, although entrig itself doesn't (as far as I know).

broðiar descends from an Early Gallo-Romance verb with non-Romance origins.
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by LinguistCat »

Is broðiar related to brodeur (to embroider) from Old French?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

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LinguistCat wrote: 06 Nov 2018 16:06 Is broðiar related to brodeur (to embroider) from Old French?
Not as far as I can tell.
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by zyma »

Could l'entrig be interpreted as an argument of broðiar?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

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shimobaatar wrote: 06 Nov 2018 18:11 Could l'entrig be interpreted as an argument of broðiar?
Indeed, this is an idiomatic expression of the form "to X the Y". Analogous constructions in English include:
to throw the game; to beg the question, to load the dice, to jump the gun, to go the distance
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by GrandPiano »

Does entrighar come from Latin intricare?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by Jackk »

GrandPiano wrote: 06 Nov 2018 19:40 Does entrighar come from Latin intricare?
Correct! [:D]

Wiktionary defines Latin intricō as I entangle, perplex, embarrass. It is the source of English intrigue.
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by zyma »

Does broðiar have a cognate in modern standard French?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by Jackk »

shimobaatar wrote: 07 Nov 2018 03:29 Does broðiar have a cognate in modern standard French?
Technically no, but really yes - that is, there are two variants of the word found in Gallo-Romance, one of which became broðiar and the other a modern French verb.
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by zyma »

Jackk wrote: 07 Nov 2018 03:34
shimobaatar wrote: 07 Nov 2018 03:29 Does broðiar have a cognate in modern standard French?
Technically no, but really yes - that is, there are two variants of the word found in Gallo-Romance, one of which became broðiar and the other a modern French verb.
Hmm... does the French verb also begin with <b>?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

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shimobaatar wrote: 07 Nov 2018 04:37 Hmm... does the French verb also begin with <b>?
Yes.
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by zyma »

Jackk wrote: 07 Nov 2018 04:44
shimobaatar wrote: 07 Nov 2018 04:37 Hmm... does the French verb also begin with <b>?
Yes.
<br->?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

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shimobaatar wrote: 07 Nov 2018 13:36<br->?
Yes - <bro-> even [:D]
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

Post by spanick »

Is broðiar realted to Modern French brouiller from Gallo-Romance *brodiculare ultimately from Proto-Germanic *bruþą "broth"?

If so, would this idiomatically be translated into English as "to mix the pot"? Perhaps more literally meaning "to stir the broth"?
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Re: Guess the Word in Romlangs

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spanick wrote: 07 Nov 2018 18:07 Is broðiar realted to Modern French brouiller from Gallo-Romance *brodiculare ultimately from Proto-Germanic *bruþą "broth"?

If so, would this idiomatically be translated into English as "to mix the pot"? Perhaps more literally meaning "to stir the broth"?
It does indeed come from *brodicare and is analogous to French brouiller "blur, mix up, confuse, scramble (an egg), set at odds, put (someone) off (something) jam."

Its primary meaning (and the meaning it has in this construction) is not mix, stir however
terram impūram incolāmus
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let us live in a dirty world
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